Elmo FP-A & FP-C Lamp Conversion

[Dan Pawlak]

Thanks for the offer, Shane. Do you have any tips for the newbie on how to lubricate the FP-C. I’ve learned from other projects/repairs that you generally can’t remove lubricant easily if it’s done improperly. 🙄 Janice, did you lubricate your FP-C, too?

[Shane C. Collins]

Well, Shane & Janice. I finished the conversion to the EJM bulb. It was a bit kludgy, but it is sturdy and aligned. See the photos. After finishing the conversion, I ran into two other problems. The film speed was very slow; even at max speed it looked like slow motion. I thought I messed something up during the bulb conversion, but I don’t think so. Even though it was working fine before the conversion, I think it needs a serious lubrication. Question: do you have any pointers on doing that? I was going to use regular lithium (white) grease but am not sure if that is compatible with the plastic gears. Applying grease to the white gears should be easy, as well as the semi-hidden worm gear; but, two areas I’m unsure about is the spindle attached to the external knob that spins when the projector is running. Would 3-in-1 oil work on that? Also, the cam that makes the claws that move the film up and down is binding at the top part of the cam action. How would I lubricate that? I’ve lubricated the motor already. the second problem is the cloudy lens. I’ve read your other posts about it, but I’d really like to clean it if I could (to avoid having to buy the Bolex lens which seems rather pricey). Here a few of the pictures I took during the bulb conversion (btw, the bracket Shane sent me, and the extra bulb, worked out great - thanks, Shane):

Dan your bulb conversion looks great! I'm happy to hear those parts worked for you! As far as the problems you are having, I think some photos with arrows pointing to problem areas would help us to help you figure this out. Owning a Elmo FP8-C I can tell lubrication is pretty straight forward. For the plastic gears I use Super Lube. This lubrication is safe for all types of plastic, and it works great. All plastic gears should be greased for smooth operation. The shutter wheel and cam should be oiled with sewing machine oil, just a few drops.

Have you replaced the belts? Old belts can cause these projectors to run slower than they should. If you haven't done so now is the time. There is a seller on eBay who sells belts for these. Changing them out is easy but does require one gear to be removed. Another thing you want to do is clean the contacts on the variable speed control. This is a rheostat control that gets dirty and will cause slow downs. Bottom line though always replace old belts, that's where I would start....

[Dan Pawlak]

Sorry, Shane for the errant post. I just saw this on the second page. 🥴
I’ll definitely get the super lube. If that doesn’t help, I’ll get the belts. The reason I hesitate to replace the belts right now, is that they look like they’re in good shape. However, the gearing looks like there is no grease on it, and it feels hard enough to rotate the external threading knob that it might make the idler wheel (if that’s what it might be called) slip on the shutter wheel. In the two photos I included the arrows point to the areas I have questions about. The other photo is one to give you a general impression of the condition of the gearing, etc.
The shaft nearest the threading knob seems like it would require something like 3-in-1 oil. The hidden worm gear seems like it should be greased, along with the rest of the plastic gears. In the other photo, the arrows point to the roller cam and the clutch (?) plate. They have grease on them, so I would not use 3-in-1 oil there. Correct? Also, how would I get in there to grease it? Just jam a lot of it in? When the cam rolls over the cam inside, I can feel some resistance, so I think that will be key.
Thanks,
Dan

[Shane C. Collins]

Sorry, Shane for the errant post. I just saw this on the second page. 🥴
I’ll definitely get the super lube. If that doesn’t help, I’ll get the belts. The reason I hesitate to replace the belts right now, is that they look like they’re in good shape. However, the gearing looks like there is no grease on it, and it feels hard enough to rotate the external threading knob that it might make the idler wheel (if that’s what it might be called) slip on the shutter wheel. In the two photos I included the arrows point to the areas I have questions about. The other photo is one to give you a general impression of the condition of the gearing, etc.
The shaft nearest the threading knob seems like it would require something like 3-in-1 oil. The hidden worm gear seems like it should be greased, along with the rest of the plastic gears. In the other photo, the arrows point to the roller cam and the clutch (?) plate. They have grease on them, so I would not use 3-in-1 oil there. Correct? Also, how would I get in there to grease it? Just jam a lot of it in? When the cam rolls over the cam inside, I can feel some resistance, so I think that will be key.
Thanks,
Dan

Thanks these photos help with a visual of your projector. It is the same internally as my FP8-C. All those plastic gears will need lubed with Super Lube. Including the large driving gear near the inching knob. I use a cotton swab to apply the Super Lube to those gears. You don't need to "cake" these gears in lube. Just make sure they are well coated and the lube is evenly distributed. The hidden worm gear shaft should also be lubed with Super Lube. The only places you want to use 3 in 1 or sewing machine oil is areas were there is a metal drive shaft and the shutter area as well. The shutter only needs a few drops where it connects to the drive shaft and other linkage. The motor belt on your unit looks fine and this style belt is usually OK as it's made from a different material that seems to last. In the photos I just see the top belt (long one) it appears to be old and a bit saggy. When this happens it won't drive the spindles properly and your overall speed will be affected. I would order a new belt at this point and replace it. Old belts are a waste of time unless you're not able to find replacements. But the belts for the FP Series Elmo's are sold worldwide and easy to get. Once you lube and oil all the drive components, and replace the belt I think you will find the speed is correct. Also as I mentioned earlier be sure to clean the variable speed switch (slider) under the bottom plate. I'm including 2 photos here. The first shows the plate you remove, long skinny metal plate with one screw. In the second photo I highlighted the area (white) where you want to clean the metal with some contact cleaner. This will get oxidized over 50 plus years. If it oxidizes too much the speed cannot be regulated properly.

[Janice Glesser]

For tight spots you want to grease just put some superlube on the end of a Q-TIP. It's flexible enough to get into and around gears.

As far as the cloudy lens is concerned... Taking that lens apart to clean is near impossible. I think I've only read where one person got it open and even with his instructions I wasn't able to do it. It may be a little pricey but I would go for the Bolex lens unless you can find someone that has a parts machine with a good lens. The lenses in the FP series were notorious for getting cloudy. And even if you could Open it up to clean it... It probably has lens fungus that will just re-occur.

[Shane C. Collins]

Janice is right these Elmo lenses are junk and the upgrade to a Bolex "hifi" will transform the projector into something worth using. I may have a spare Bolex lens you can have, I'll look around. In fact, send me a private message as a reminder if you're interested. Also just an FYI, not all Bolex lenses will work with these Elmos. You need the smaller diameter lens from the first generation Bolex 18-5 Standard 8 machine.

[Dan Pawlak]

Shane, I’m going to Home Depot tomorrow for the Super Lube, and will let you know how it goes. BTW, I’ll probably use Deoxit on the rheostat. I use it on most, if not all, electrical connections, especially the center conductors in coax connectors. I’m an amateur radio operator and everyone in the ham community swears by it.
Janice, can you point me to the instructions for cleaning the Elmo lens? I’d like to at least give it a try to salvage it.

[Janice Glesser]

https://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-b...=011394#000000

Dan take a look at the above thread. I give my initial cleaning instructions and others have added additional suggestions.

[Shane C. Collins]

I'm happy to report Dan will be taking a Bolex 'hifi' from my collection to fit into his Elmo. The stock Elmo lens leaves a lot to be desired, LOL. This upgrade will transform his Elmo into a great little workhorse with stunning images!

[Dan Pawlak]

Janice, thanks for the link to the Elmo lens cleaning thread. You and others have had quite the adventure cleaning that lens. I’m sure I will benefit from all that experience.
Shane, thank you for the Bolex. It’s nice knowing that there is a good replacement lens for the FP-C. You asked for my address: it’s the same one you used to send me the bulb bracket.
BTW, I bounced around to a bunch of different stores trying to locate one that sold Super Lube in store. The one I found that carried it was Harbor Freight.

[Thomas Dafnides]

I remember reading a post some time ago, where someone took the original bulb....broke the glass (rag wrapped around it) and removed it ... then inserted an halogen bulb (without a reflector) in where the filament was, so he could ultilize the original incandescent bulb reflector. After connecting the bulb wiring to the new halogen bulb terminals, he then inserted it into the original base without having to modify the projector at all .

[Dan Pawlak]

Thomas, that sounds very interesting. Another option is to use to the EJM bulb (with reflector) and somehow attach it to the base of the original DCA bulb, after removing the glass shell and reflector. If someone knows of a high-temperature glue, that should be very easy to do.

[Steve Lee]

In France, in most of the DIY shops it is possible to purchase a glue/paste that is designed for attaching a new fire seal to the doors of wood burners, that is designed to withstand very high temperatures ( not much point otherwise ).
Then this paste dries it looks like the same compound used to fix halogen bulbs into glass reflectors.
Steve