Cartridge CAD models, measurements, or blueprints, for super-8 and single-8

[Jenny List]

A little progress update. The model in the photo above went through a few more iterations. Surprisingly complex shapes, film cartridges!

Here's a pic of current progress. Needs power supply (batteries) installing, then it becomes a software problem.

[Jenny List]

All I can say is: watch this space

So far on my 4th prototype cartridge. I have a real one to copy waiting for me at my friend's house in the UK, but haven't had a chance to pick it up. Meanwhile I'm tweaking my design.

The first aim is to end up with something equivalent to 8mm film in quality and framerate. I'm looking for the Super 8 aesthetic from original lenses & cameras, if I wanted 4K at 60fps I'd use an appropriate camera instead.

I'm not planning sound, it would be too noisy alongside the camera mechanism. Super 8 cameras are surprisingly noisy inside.

However the advantage of digital production is that you can record the sound on something as simple as a mobile phone and bring the two together in post production.

[Julian Baquero]

Dear Jenny, I am an industrial designer and have electronics engineering studies. I am a fan and collector of film, anyway I find your project interesting. Super 8 film has become increasingly expensive and difficult to develop, in my country Colombia, the only option is DIY or sending the film abroad at very high cost. I have two very nice Canon super 8 cameras in perfect working condition, so having the option to use the camera to record digitally seems to my as a useful idea. I hate the idea of having the cameras just as decoration. It would also be nice to have the option to record audio digitally. Super 8 sound cartridges are long gone and won't come back. It would be even better (though I don't have the slightest idea of how to do it) if it were possible to alternate between digital and analog.

[Jenny List]

I thought people might like to see my CAD model taking shape.

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Speaking about expired film stock on sale...

Just saw this on my local Facebook Group. A seller putting a few rolls of expired 16mm negative stock on sale for less than $40 & shipping included - sweet.
Unfortunately, for clarification (I assume) the seller was kind enough to take all films out of its can, cut open its sealed bag, and lay all down on the table to take several clear shots of the whole lot...


What a honest & helpful seller.

(Sorry I can't resist hijacking this thread.)

[Jenny List]

Wow, thanks everyone!

Tom, I'll send you a DM

[Tom Dennis]

Good Morning Jenny,

In my drawer of "justins" I have an unsed super 8 cartridge, as you live in U.K. will drop in a jiffy bag if this is any use to you. [N/C]

Have asked my no.2 son to have a look in his odds n sodds for single 8

Good luck with your project.
Tom Dennis

[Maurice Leakey]

Jenny
Single 8 never caught on in the UK, but here is a cartridge for sale. Very rare.
Fujifilm Single-8 Cine Film Cartridge Fujichrome RT50 Out of | Etsy UK

[Maurice Leakey]

Jenny
Here is a Super 8 cartridge for sale. No bids at present. Sale finishes today at 18.13 GMT.
Kodak Super 8 Film Movie Cartridge Unmarked Kodachrome No box | eBay

[Steve Klare]

Well, I am seeing them on my side of the Pond for maybe $15 US, but by the same token the ones I am seeing as "sold" are often under $10. What's sad is back in the day, I bought fresh ones with processing for less than 4 dollars! (Mom and Dad were very kind: they gave me a generous amount of space on the bottom shelf in their 'fridge!)

There's a lot of dead film for sale, and not a ton of demand: a buyer's market!

I've always found Single-8 fascinating: with it's unlimited rewinding and real pressure plate that was part of the camera. I wouldn't have minded if it became the 8mm standard. Never, ever have I seen it in real life. It's not that you will never find it, it's just it may take a while!

[Jenny List]

Good point. Am I likely to encounter people who believe an expired film cartridge from the 1970s is their ticket to untold wealth?

I've not seen any single-8 cartridges for sale, but have to confess I wasn't exploring that avenue.

[Steve Klare]

Hi Jenny,

There are always plenty of Super-8 cartridges available on E-Bay, generally full of expired film that has a slim to none chance of ever being processed.

Some of them actually sell, but most are just there...

Your work is interesting, and it's possible that a 3D printed S8 cartridge could be itself a sellable item. I'm not sure if Kodak still sells the empties.

[Jenny List]

So having I hope established some credentials, can I ask again. Does anyone have measurements, blueprints, or even real cartridges we can measure, for super-8 and single-8?

[Jenny List]

I sense some skepticism from the replies above. Please take a look at the Raspberry Pi link above.

Maybe i should say something about the world I come from to throw some context. I'm an electronic engineer and technical journalist. I'm one of the staff writers and editors for a website called hackaday.com ( https://hackaday.com ). Our world is that of hackerspaces and makerspaces, engineers and other people who make stuff for fun, including very high-tech stuff. Our toys are 3D printing, computer aided design, surface-mount electronics, and precision assembly. So yes, I'm building a digital cartridge, and it will work.

On my desk right now: an imperfect 3D print of a super-8 cartridge (it's not quite right and doesn't fit some of my cameras. Without a real one to compare I can't easily tell where it's wrong.), a miniature 2 megapixel camera module (I'll remove the lens when placed in an 8mm camera), and an ESP32 module. I suggest you Google the ESP32, it's a dual-core RISC microcontroller, essentially a quite powerful all-in-one computer with built-in wi-fi, all for a few dollars.

[Jenny List]

I also remember a sensor and digital storage for SLR cameras being proposed so that you didn't have to buy a new camera and that it could be replaced as new and better sensor chips came out. That never made it either - too much interest in selling new cameras all the time I should imagine.

I remember that too. The reason it never came to anything is that the sensor size is relatively huge, and thus either crazy expensive, or unobtainable.