Of Stripes and Recording ...

[Osi Osgood]

I know that this has been discussed repeatedly, but perhaps we can get more info. When I first collected super 8 in the late 80's, I wanted to do a recording experiment, but I didn't want to ruin the soundtrack on my existing prints, so I took a whole bunch of countdown leader, spliced together, to fill a 50ft reel. I then plugged in my portable CD player (still fairly new tech at the time) directly to my Chinon 9500, ( my new projector at the time), and I recorded the Bread song, " Make it with you", and upon playback, was quite surprised as to how good it actually sounded, as most magnetic soundtracks tended to be muffled and certainly not sharp. Having said that, I have noticed that my best soundtrack recordings have most definitely been on that old Kodak prestriped films. That "drip" stripe has been far less reliable. Your thoughts, ladies and gentlemen?

[John Taylor]

What is drip stripe?
The prestripe stocks are well proven in both quality and time. Any muffled recordings would have been poor equipment or wrong sertings. IMO

[Osi Osgood]

Drip means the modern non prestriped film. I wonder if part of the reason for that muffled sound, was the 4X speed recording that Derann did. While it certainly allowed quicker recording, audio quality may have been compromised.

[John Taylor]

I have read about this elswhere on here, as i understand it, i think you mean the later derann made oxide or paste stripe which used so much glue to hold it onto the film, the quality of sound was compromised resulting in pops,bumps or hiss,or in some cases all three.

[Osi Osgood]

Paste stripe was what I meant to say. While the main stripe would be adequate for a decent recording, the balance stripe could be a little as a "trickle", sometimes not even a complete line, and it's obviously very hard to get a good recording on that. In the worst case scenario, the main stripe could drip onto the actual film image, spotting the whole print. I have had a few prints over the years, that have had this damage. This not to say that pre-striped film didn't occasionally have it's issues, sometimes completely wandering into the right edge of the projected image, drifting back and forth.

[Brian Fretwell]

I thi9nk that may have been one of the reasons Kodak discontiued pre-stripe film, too much wasteage and complaints.

[Kim Trampus]

I remember that my filmmaker friend Dan had a machine that would add a press on magnetic track to silent film.

[Brian Fretwell]

Yes. I have one of those, we called it laminate striping, basically cementing a narrow piece of magnetic recording tape to the film.

[Graham Ritchie]

The little "Rexette" was one of those striping machines and it worked really well. All the laminated stripe I did 40 years or so then on our home movies is still good to this day, do note though, that laminated stripe will only stick to acetate film stock and not polyester.

[Osi Osgood]

I had one, but the problem was that the cement/ glue used must have lost its potency, as the stripe wouldn't stay on. Poor glue/cement has been the tragedy of many a print. I had the final reel of "The Mark of Zorro". Beautiful scope image, nice and sharp, but the stripe was literally peeling off of the film as it projected.

[Tim Gillett]

...The prestripe stocks are well proven in both quality and time.

Yes my experience also. Kodak did a great job adhering the stripes to the unexposed film and they've lasted well.

Any muffled recordings would have been poor equipment or wrong sertings. IMO

I agree. As I demonstrated in a recent YT upload (link below), even the very narrow balance stripe on a Super 8 film can sound quite good when recorded and played back properly on good, well maintained equipment. But then the balance stripe while narrower than a cassette track (stereo), at 24 FPS is running at around 4 ips, more than double standard cassette speed, so you'd expect it had potentially good sound.

So while many sound striped films have probably lasted well if stored well, the super 8 sound projectors these days can be all over the place in sound reproduction quality. I wonder how many technicians these days will even take on fully servicing a super 8 sound projector, and if they do will inspect the record/play head for wear. These heads are often badly worn, often resulting in muffled and erratic sound. Yesterday I was pleased to read that one European supplier still carries a new Super 8 mag stripe head as an off the shelf spare part. These days this seems rare.

https://youtu.be/wBRSRIflDq0?si=afoyGt5UFe7L4eVl

[Osi Osgood]

What make or model is this sound head for? Usually, for some makes of projectors, you have to buy a "spare parts" projector, to keep up your working projectors.

[John Taylor]

One thing I do know, speaking to other collectors, the later oxide/paste/liquid stripes will wreck heads a lot quicker due to there uneven application and in some, (not all) cases how abrasive they are.

[Tim Gillett]

What make or model is this sound head for? Usually, for some makes of projectors, you have to buy a "spare parts" projector, to keep up your working projectors.

I found one for a Bauer on the Wittner site and some for Eumigs on the Van Eck site. In parts search type in "soundhead".

Another long used option for worn magnetic sound heads is relapping the face to restore its sound fidelity. As a technician over the past 40 years I've relapped countless tape machine heads including 8mm sound projector heads . The balance stripe transfer I linked to above was made using a Super 8 stereo head which I had relapped.

[Tim Gillett]

One thing I do know, speaking to other collectors, the later oxide/paste/liquid stripes will wreck heads a lot quicker due to there uneven application and in some, (not all) cases how abrasive they are.

Yes but it's worse than that. Even with an excellent stripe, a new head in an 8mm sound projector will usually be quickly worn down because of the way the stripe is brutally pressed against the head's face, leading to premature, uneven head wear. It's one of the main reasons I no longer use a sound projector to transfer the sound stripe. Given the limited or non existent supply of new heads, extending the life of existing heads can be the only option.