Workprinter XP Modifications

[Harry Alder]

I have problems with my WP with getting the full 8mm frame aligned in my camcorder window and I believe it is related to the angle/adjustment of the reflecting lens. I think it is slightly out of alignment.

Anyway, after doing a lot of reading on the old forum and looking at a lot of YT videos, I think I need to modify my WP to not use the reflecting lens and have the camera shoot directly into the film gate.

1. If you have done this mod, did you also enlarge the gate area? I have seen a few videos where they drilled out the gate area to ensure they had the entire 8mm frame, plus some overlap, in the output picture.

2. My WP has the led lamp now but if I change to shoot directly into the gate, do I also need to change to a different led lamp?

3. Did you add any kind of diffuser lens because it is now shooting straight into the gate?

4. Are there additional mods that I should be thinking about to improve the process? Right now, the alignment of the camera to the reflecting lens is a major pain. Especially when you don't have a dedicated space for the conversion and you have to set it up multiple times. If I can shoot directly into the gate then I can more permanently mount the camera with the WP and solve that problem.

5. Is there a source for belts/wheels, etc. for the WP? One of my belts/orings looks like it's nearing the end of its life.

thanks for any assistance,

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Gee, seems like you're aiming to the same path I'd walked through before.

1.Not absolutely necessary, but it's quite a normal practice to slightly underscan the entire frame then trim it in the post. The enlarged aperture would be then necessary.
2.My general rule of thumb is that if you can see the backlit frame comfortably with your bare eyes, that should be good enough to your camera to capture too.
(A tad "too bright" picture could be remedied with higher shutter speed, as I might add)
3.Absolutely yes. There must be some sort of diffuser to soften the light source.
4.Shooting straight into the film gate is the best possible approach. Least amount of elements involved = least possible trouble.
5.I ALWAYS use plain simple o-ring found at any hardware store as replacement for ALL of my super8 projectors. Works fine for me.

This is my rude&crude setup of my frame x frame "film scanner".
Nothing fancy, a heavily modified projector, a good old standard def. camcorder (Sony TRV950 in this case), and ScenalyzerLive! software mentioned earlier in previous post. All i all it works just fine for me.

[Janice Glesser]

Hi Harry.... My responses to your questions are going to be directly geared toward the Moviestuff Workprinter XP since I have the same equipment.

Here are the things you DO NOT have to do:

1. No need to enlarge the frame opening on the gate. Moviestuff has already enlarged the frame opening on Workprinters.

2. No changes to the lamp.

3. Again no modification necessary. The lamp on the Workprinter shoots indirectly to the gate. The light is reflected off a white piece of plastic to the back of the film frame. This acts as a diffuser.

4. Shooting off the gate in the long run simplifies the process...but getting the right components and setting it up correctly is key.

5. I make my own belts...but you can buy belts for the Workprinter on Ebay https://tinyurl.com/ux6uug6 .The Workprinter is basically a GAF projector that was modified by Moviestuff. The model placard is probably located on the machine somewhere. They only used a couple of different base models.


As you probably already know... there is a difference between real-time capture and frame-by-frame. However when it comes to the camera, lens, and positioning to capture off the gate the configuration is the same.



There’s a lot more details involved that would take me some time to gather. I have created a off-the-gate capture system that works for me, but I can’t guarantee it will work for you. There are so many variables.


Basic Camera and lens configurations:


I use two types of camera and lens configurations that have worked equally well. One uses a Raynox DCR-250 Super Macro lens attached to a Canon camcorder. In this setup the projector lens is removed.



In the 2nd configuration I replaced the projector lens with a 16mm lens from Keystone K-160 16mm projector I bought off the Goodwill. In this setup no lens is needed on the camcorder. Here is a video of that setup.

Here is a sample of what the raw capture looks like before any post processing. The image will be inverted and the frame is over-scanned which can be later flipped and cropped. From my observation...the macro lens is less sharp but is not as grainy...while the 16mm lens is a bit sharper but shows more grain. Both captures can be enhanced with post processing.



...with post processing.



If you are capturing in SD then this is all you need. HD is a lot more complicated and expensive.

I'm glad you got Cinecap to work. FYI...Cinecap will capture SD and HD.

[Harry Alder]

Thank you Nantawat and Janice. I now have a lot of "homework" to do. I'll report back as I make changes.

[Tom Fales]

Janice - I'm sure I've seen the answer to this before, but do you know if the Cinecap Velocity HD software works with the Workprinter XP? I've been using a Workprinter-HD for years but am curious whether if I substituted an XP for the HD Workprinter it would work. I think it will but not sure anymore what the specific difference in these machines were.

[Janice Glesser]

I've only used the Cinecap Std. with the XP for both SD and HD captures... but the only difference that I can see between the XP and the HD is the extra hardware peripherals. Seems to me that the software is only working with the frame output. Although doesn't the HD work with the velocity box? The software may require a signal from that box....just don't know. If you try it... let us know.

[Tom Fales]

Janice - I found the answer. The Cinecap Velocity software apparently works with both the XP and the HD versions of Workprinter. Now to find an old XP (preferably R-B-G) unit to upgrade . . .

[Chris Burchfield]

I've only used the Cinecap Std. with the XP for both SD and HD captures... but the only difference that I can see between the XP and the HD is the extra hardware peripherals. Seems to me that the software is only working with the frame output. Although doesn't the HD work with the velocity box? The software may require a signal from that box....just don't know. If you try it... let us know.

Janice, do you sync your frame captures using the modified mouse triggering to Cinecap software, or do you use the velocity software?

[Janice Glesser]

Chris Burchfield Sync mouse.

[Chris Burchfield]

Chris Burchfield Sync mouse.

I'm assuming your system uses internal SSD. I am thinking about using an external SSD connected thru USB 3.0 for WP frame captures, any thoughts on this configuration. I am researching my best options before making a purchase.

[Janice Glesser]

Chris Burchfield I'm using a Samsung 850 EVO 500GB 2.5-Inch SATA III Internal SSD in an older model i5 HP Pavillion. It captures frames in HD with no problem. My guess is that an external SSD with a USB III would be equally as fast...maybe faster....just check the specs. Since I haven't used an external SSD for captures I can't advise.

[Chris Burchfield]

Janice Glesser I question if my WP gate was enlarged because I do not see film holes along edge of super 8mm on my unit. Are you seeing all the way to the edges on both S8 and R8?

[Janice Glesser]

As far as I know all WP's had the gate frame enlarged. Are you capturing in 4x3 or wide-screen? Make sure you are zoomed out to capture the entire frame opening.

Here is what my original un-cropped images look like. You can see more of the sprocket holes in standard 8mm.

Standard 8mm


Super 8mm

[Chris Burchfield]

Janice Glesser Do you use Cinecap speed change option or adjust speed in post processing? After capturing some HD I used Cinecap to change to 18fps but the new file resolution was 480p.

[Janice Glesser]

Chris Burchfield I only use Cinecap for capturing in HD and do the speed changes in VirtualDub or Adobe Premiere. Cinecap was designed for SD and the speed change feature can't handle the larger image size of HD.