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I'm not sure I have the patience/fortitude to deal with doing it myself. Does anyone have recommendations or warnings on professional 8mm digitizing services? The Kodak website sounds legit but... what else should be considered?
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https://store.film-tech.com/film-lab...ning-services/
Yes, it is the same company that provides us this forum. I have my own scanner, so I have not used their service. -
One of the companies that gets thrown around a lot with good reason is Pro8mmOriginally posted by Mark Eble View Post
https://www.pro8mm.com/Comment
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Has anyone had any experience using the KODAK Digitizing service for standard 8mm? They charge by the reel, not by the foot and the prices are dramatically lower than the services mentioned above.Comment
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All I'm going to say with that is that you get what you pay for. If you pay less it's usually because people are using an older Telecine scanner, or something less like a person at home using a Wolverine, which is fine, if all you want to do is watch the footage. Most people SHOOTING new footage these days want to do something more than just watch it, either digitally, or projected. They usually want to use it on some other short content format E.G. Instagram (Reels), TikTok, or Youtube (Shorts) for less than 3minute footage.
Then, secondly If you want quality then you must pay more for it, especially if you want to be social and show it to the entire world. You can see the quality that Super 8mm has above... Do you want that sort of quality? Or do you want someone at home with a Wolverine?
It's your choice... Your choice may limit your options as to how others view your content.
There are other ways of saving costs of course... such as buying Ektachrome and learning how to develop E6 at home then using a DSLR to scan each frame, that's certainly possible, or even developing it yourself, and then sending it to someone else to scan. Or sending it to someone else and then scanning at 2.5k or even 1080p. If you want to learn how to develop by bucket, or reel, in something like a Paterson tank, you can save some money there. Any DSLR, or mirrorless camera can capture each frame at 4K or even 8K these days. So you can save some money there IF you want to spend the time, but that much is your own business...
At the end of the day though Mark, I hate to break this to you... Shooting motion picture film IS expensive. There isn't really any way around that. And secondly, a few other other things. Inflation is what inflation does, while it might have cost $10 30 years ago, you would have to adjust for today's prices through inflation. Thirdly, there isn't the same amount of volume, with the way it is right now, an iPhone 14 pro has a two-thirds inch sensor which is better than most digital film cameras from 15 years ago (which was enough even then back then with Hi8). To say that an iPhone is better than any Hi8 camera is all kinds of ridiculous, but it is.
You already have a camera in your pocket that can shoot 4k at 24fps, in 12bit RAW, it's been that way since the iPhone 12... Why the hell would you waste your time with 8mm? Most people would not... and therein lies the third point above... You can now shoot a full cinema length movie on an iPhone, there are kits that allow you to mount PL mount lenses on an iPhone. Lady Gaga did it with Stupid Love deliberately as one example of "shot on an iPhone..." I'm not sure how much Apple paid her to do that but still... This is the issue... and this is without realizing how pitifully low MTV viewership has been since its peak in 2002 (let alone since its peak in the 1980s and 1990s as the "MTV generation") that I doubt a lot of people have even seen this video.
So I ask again Mark, WHY THE BEEP WOULD THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE SHOOT CINEMA FILM? I hate to break this down for you Mark, but most people outside of cinema geeks won't even care if you shot your footage on a potato quality camera, they just want to see the footage, not the process...
I ask you that as the biggest problem... and I tell you, the people on this forum are NOT the vast majority of people. The vast majority would just pick up their iPhone or Samsung Galaxy phone e.g. an S24, and shoot video with that because IT IS good enough, that it can be colour graded in 12bit HDR, to be viewed in Dolby Vision on your TV.
So I ask you when you ask how much it costs, why you're not asking the real question... Why the hell would the vast majority of people would bother?
I'm not being a troll here either, I'm asking a serious question aout how you think you can make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. You keep asking for a CHEAPER option. The only realistic way to make things cheaper is:- Buy Ektachrome.
- Learn how to develop E6 at home.
- Scan the film yourself at home.
The reason why you're getting a cynical answer by now, is because you're not looking at all the factors involved. You're just saying:
"I WANT IT CHEAPER!"
Well the cheaper option if you can't afford film is to use your iPhone. Sorry, there is no cheap way to shoot and develop actual film.Last edited by Orestes Roumeliotis; April 04, 2023, 02:50 AM.Comment
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I'm sorry, I have not been communicating clearly. I have 32 5 inch reels of standard 8 home movies shot by my father in the 50s and 60s. I am simply trying to make it available to family members without a projector/screen etc. and to preserve it for future generations. I don't intend to do any editing and I don't intend to shoot anymore film of any kind. I just want to transfer the film to a digital media. The reviews of the Wolverine are not encouraging. The difference between the Kodak service and the Pro 8mm service is several thousands of dollars. I'm trying to find someone who might have used the Kodak service. Many thanks!Comment
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Without a doubt, anyone experienced with the MWA scanner. It's not just the scanner its the skill to achieve the best for your clients.
All my 16mm, 9.5 and 8mm filmed have been scanned by this excellent system so I can archive them. Personally I would look no further.
Be aware that if you go for its highest resolution 4k the file size is huge. I've worked in media for a good few decades now and managing 4K is a challenge.
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I had some stuff scanned to test a new (to me) Yashica Super 40, I had it done up on a Laser Graphics scan station, the conservative price for 50ft of film is around $50, and then that again if you need it developed $100 at 4k with a 2.5k in lay of the entire frame (i.e. overscan). There's not much getting around that, my local lab charges $35 for scans in 1080p which would be enough for what this person wants, but not for professional stuff these days.Originally posted by Lee Mannering View Post
Then again, Richard doesn't do old films.... You would need to find someone like Film Rescue: https://www.filmrescue.com/ that specialises in restoring old films. Sometimes its worth scanning in 4K sometimes its not. For really old stuff where the quality is already poor due to film age it's probably not.
If you just want scans of old films, finding a place like Film Rescue would be the place to go to. If you're scanning in 4K you will get very little change out of 5GB if its done professionally, the file sizes are huge, but that's because you're extracting every possible scan line you can out of the film. I reckon on a good day that would be maybe 1440p out of a 4K scan (good enough to be equivalent of a standard 1080p BluRay at least, and good enough for Cinema 2.5k (which you can grade with actual digital 4k as seen in the 8k scan above down sampled to 4K for YouTube). But then like I said you're paying somewhere in the order of $150 for 50ft of film if you're shooting new, developing and scanning from a pro lab... Very few people do that regularly. I was just testing some camera gear to make sure it was working as intended.
Is it worth it? This hobby is only really worth whatever you think it is, it's gonna take a lot of time even if you get monetised from your first cheque on YouTube where they give you $20 for your first 1000 subscribers. It may even take years to reach that point where you hit 1000 subscribers, it depends on what your niche is for using this footage... I've seen a lot of younger people return to Super 8 for making their music videos, for indy bands because of its particular look. Super 8 is the most "film like" film out of the can because it's not quite perfect, and already comes with a haze on it.
Although, the reality is, most of us still working with actual film are doing it for the love not the money. Even when you do finish grading them to a quality for YouTube your video uploads for Super 8 footage will be about 500mb for 2:30 of 4k footage. And then, like myself, you need something like an M1 MacBook Pro to grade it without it grinding your computer to a halt. It's really not fun to work with, and it wastes a lot of data going backwards and forwards to even get it up on the internet... and then for what??
Analogue Resurgance is probably one of the most succesful channels in this niche and that's sitting on about 60k people who've smashed the subscribe button.
https://www.youtube.com/@AnalogResurgence
It's not really a money making venture at all.Last edited by Orestes Roumeliotis; April 05, 2023, 02:22 AM.Comment
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We use a 6.5K Lasergraphics HDR scanner. It's the best scanner money can buy for 8mm.
The Kodak service is apparently the same as Legacybox. From what I've been able to find out, it's a bunch of old MovieStuff scanners...and it shows.
Here is an example. Note the source film was not reversal Kodachrome or negative stock, it was literally a dupe print on faded Eastmancolor stock with some scenes that had highlights blown out and some blacks crushed. Still you can see the incredible (sarcastic) quality of Legacybox and other similar services.
FYI - The bouncing you see on the second transfer was built into the print, as the sprocket holes were absolutely rock steady on the scan. The first transfer though, that's all Legacybox.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSj3RbdhjzA&t=1073s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwP9z5YvZ5Q
We also run a YouTube channel for fun where we have been uploading something every single day for the last 3 years. Most of the uploads there are sourced from 35mm, but there are some 16mm scans on there as well. (Obviously ignore the quality of the "shot on video and transferred to film" commercials. People seem to really love seeing them though.)
https://www.youtube.com/c/FTDepot/videos
Here are a few specific rare or lost films that may be of interest to the group here:
Most commercials in Australia back in the 1980s were shot in scope with Dolby surround audio...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SajJiTi6SlY
Ghostbusters promotional film for Showest 1984...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqpumEZmxa0
The Evolution of Networks / Concierto Evolucion (for the Siemens Pavilion at Expo 92)...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ickd06a7GOI
Chevy Show (Six Flags amusement park thrill ride film)...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OO5mpSZ8IY
Then of course there are lots and lots of theater logos, policy trailers, etc...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vSdIsv6TkZs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okN9tBxWOOg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otsN86I3mW8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlL4xIneueI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJXCHH44M8E
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKnKjyzFYJY
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