Subtitles: On

[Ed Gordon]

In recent years, the dialogue in movies and TV shows has gotten harder and harder to understand. No one seems to agree on who or what the main culprit is, much less how to fix this problem. In this episode, we wade into the murky waters of The Great Dialogue Debate, and maybe, just maybe, find a solution.

Link to podcast: https://www.20k.org/episodes/subtitleson

Transcript of podcast: Use the link above and you will find a "View Transcript" option. The full text is too large to include in a single post.

[Lincoln Thorn]

Unless I'm running a film, I feel like I pretty much always had subs on for any movie/show I watch these days!

[Ed Gordon]

Today's horrible sound mixes essentially require we use subtitles. Another option is Volume Leveling:

Volume Leveling automatically adjusts the playback volume in order to maintain a consistent level regardless of the source material. Many people have Volume Leveling enabled all of the time as a way to minimize the need for manual volume adjustments.

I have avoided using volume leveling since I believe explosions should be loader than dialogue, but not so much louder that your ears ring.

[Mark McLaughlin]

Unfortunately maybe we are all a bunch of old dudes. I can’t stand subtitles unless I’m watching Cinema Paradiso or something. Just buy a vintage equalizer and make it work for your ears?

[Ed Gordon]

It is not a matter of age:

Ashley: In a 2022 survey, half of the respondents said that they mostly watch movies with the subtitles on. And this isn't just older people who might have hearing issues. Young people in high school and college are actually the most likely to watch with subtitles.

[Brian Fretwell]

Some shows, Dr Who in particular, have been accused of now using a mix that is OK for dialogue on a full 5.1 system but makes it hard to hear it clearly when TVs downmix to 5.1. A matter of not testing properly before it being given the OK for release/tranmission.

[Graham Ritchie]

I agree Ed and its a problem that's been around for quite a while now, even at the cinema I always made sure the center channel was the one to go by then the rest to follow but not to ever make the other ones drive out the dialogue. We had experts that would come every six months or so with there lap top etc and adjust the levels on the amps etc if they needed it. The last thing we all did while they were here and after any adjustments were made, was to all go into each cinema, sit down and just listen . They would then say to me what do you think, I would say, sounds good to me, then that was it for another six months, but it was that center channel the dialogue, that was the one I would mainly focus on.

As far as sub-titles I have never had a problem with them, I remember booking a print of "Letters From Iwo Jima" directed by Clint Eastwood being the Japan version of the landings had English sub-titles. The staff thought I was nuts to book a film with sub-titles, well the film did very well and not one complaint, see I said later to the downstairs staff I was right

[Ed Gordon]

... A matter of not testing properly before it being given the OK for release/tranmission.

I agree Brian, there are either no standards, or if there are, they are routinely ignored. Nobody seem to be doing any sort of quality control.

... its a problem that's been around for quite a while now, even at the cinema I always made sure the center channel was the one to go by then the rest to follow but not to ever make the other ones drive out the dialogue. We had experts that would come every six months or so with there lap top etc and adjust the levels on the amps etc if they needed it. ...)

I don't think that exhibitors are significant contributors to the problem. Sound mixes don't seem to follow any standard. Overall volume varies from source to source. Dialogue is buried in background noise and music.

I came across this comment on Reddit that sums it up pretty well:

I get all the reasons, it's still bullshit. Movies should sound good coming from my TV. I'm not buying the film for a movie theater, I'm buying the "home video" release. They can fix it. They choose not to. That's the long and short, and if a director doesn't like that we'll hear a different mix than the one in cinemas that's their problem to get over. Mix an extra track, approve it, move on if you actually care. Because guess what? When I have to play remote control jockey I am sure as shit not hearing it as intended either. That excuse doesn't fly with me.

We're being sold a sub-par product.

[Steven J. Kirk]

I use 3 x two-channel stereo Hi-Fi amps. That is the only way I have found to have control over the dialogue that in most modern films from Blu Ray or DVD is in the centre channel. So the centre amp goes to a double stack of centre speakers. Left and right becomes top and bottom. These Kef centres have bass units. This is also my mono channel for 16mm and super 8 mono. Plenty of cone area for meaty mono. Then on 5 way sound I can up the centre to anything I want. So Left/Right Rear, Double Centre and Left/Right Front are 3 separate systems, really. You need to have all RCA phono to do it.

[Graham Ritchie]

Steven your idea of separate amps is the way to go. I use a single Yamaha amp and you can adjust the sound levels for each channel, but its really limited to what you can do, where as, having a set up like yours would give a much greater range of adjustments.

[Steven J. Kirk]

Yes, I always liked the Yamaha amps in the days of Dolby Surround but with DVD and Blu Ray you have discrete channels so no decoder required and you can deal with each channel separately.

[Steven J. Kirk]

These NAD amps were not that expensive really and have all analogue inputs which these days isn't that common.

[Steven J. Kirk]

RCA phono Y lead required to take centre channel from blu ray player to both channels of double stack centre amp.

[David M. Leugers]

I think a part of the problem is the ever-growing list of actors who seem intent on mumbling their lines just above a whisper. Just because the audio man can pick up something doesn't mean it qualifies as acceptable annunciation. If the lines don't matter, why say them at all? I guess there is something to be said for stage trained actors.