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Topic: Optical Prints
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Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted July 25, 2005 01:36 PM
Funny how this thread keeps coming back, I'm glad it does though because the whole Airline print thing fascinates me. Just when you think you have covered all the prints ever to make it on to the market, another one pops up. I have been looking for a long time for 'On Golden Pond' if any one comes across a copy for sale any where please let me know. I was also surprised to hear that Ghost Busters is around somewhere too, I shall be looking out for that one as well...
Derek Simmonds wrote about Airline Prints in the Winter 1998 issue of FFTC and as there seems so much interest in the subject I have taken the liberty of reproducing it here.
Full credit of course goes to the Late Great Derek Symmonds and the Film For The Collector Magazine.
quote: A few years ago I was at Rank Film Labs in Denham, having gone there to collect some work they had produced for us. I was having a chat with Roy Hubbard, the manager of the department at that time, when a gentleman entered the room. He was introduced to me and it was explained that he worked for the company that provided 8mm optical prints for the airlines. This fascinated me, and being the film fanatic that I am, I wanted to know more. I stayed and talked with him for nearly two hours, and eventually he said “next time you’re down here, give me a ring and I will come and collect you and take you round our place”. I made sure that I visited the labs the next week, and before setting out I telephoned my new found friend. He promised to come along to the labs and we would then go on to his main depot. When I left the labs, following the car in front, I was more than a little surprised to find we were heading towards the Technicolor Labs, near Heathrow Airport. We swung through the main gates, drove round the main building and ended up at the rear of the labs. There I saw a sign SUNSTRAND, and it was then that I realised that this was the company that I had come to visit.
I was led into a small office, and told that most of the prints were printed at Technicolor Labs in New York, whilst Rank Labs also provided prints of their own titles and some of the British TV material, but it was explained that the airlines preferred the material that was printed in New York since Technicolor ‘coated’ the sound tracks and this rendered much better results.
If you compare an 8mm Optical Print made in the UK against an American print, you will note that the optical track is almost pure black and white, whereas the track on a British print is dark blue. This results in the British track giving a lower level of volume and certainly more track noise, hiss and plops. Rank would never give any reason for not coating the optical tracks on 8mm prints. I hasten to add, that all 16mm prints made by the lab at the lab at that time, were coated to give optimum performances. One can only assume that in their opinion, 8mm was just not important enough for them to provide this extra service.
I was then told that a lot of the prints carried multi-tracks; the main track always being in English. But, on some prints there was another track, just on the edge of the sprocket holes, much like the balance track on a magnetic print, and this track was mostly French, German or Spanish.
I was then taken into the room where the films were checked upon return from the air craft, and where new prints were being put on to giant spools for polishing. I was astounded at the number of prints in the room – it must have been at least five or six thousand! Can you imagine standing in front of five or six thousand full length 8mm sound feature, 99% of which were never going to be offered to the collector?
When the prints came in from the various labs, they were in the same number of roles as the 16mm prints, since they had been taken from the 16mm negatives. For aircraft use they need to be on one continuous reel, so the first job was the splicing together of all the various reels. The films were then coated with a silicone polish, and then flat wound into a giant cartridge, as one continuous roll, ie; the film came form the outer edge of the large roll, went through the projector gate and sound head and wound back onto the inside of the roll. This is the reason that the films were coated with silicone, to make them very smooth and slippery, and to avoid emulsion build up and scratching. After this they were put onto projectors, the same Technicolor machines that the airlines used, each print was run, and then the prints shipped to various airlines. At one time there were twenty projectors running, checking films. These specially made machines had Xenon lamps, and the sound out put was remarkably good. Much better than the quality received through those dreadful earphones they give you on the plane!
Once the films had served their purpose, they were returned to the various dumps around the world and supposedly junked. I was at SUNSTRAND at one time when they destroyed about 500 feature films, and an official from the film industry stood there whilst they put an axe through every print. ( I don’t think I have ever got over the shock).
It seems that some prints have got out from various dumps, and have found their way onto the market. I must say that a few years ago I did persuade Warner Bros and Columbia to sell us a few prints, which they did. I think we had about ten titles in all and about fifty copies of each. But sadly, the airlines soon stopped using 8mm, when cheaper, video copies became available, and as far as I am aware, no 8mm prints are now made for airline use. If you are offered an ex-airline print, make sure they are not turning pink, as most of them were printed at the time when Eastman stock was suspect.
Mike
-------------------- Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...
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Barry Attwood
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1411
From: Enfield, U.K.
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted July 26, 2005 02:46 AM
Kevin,
I have had also copies of "Back To The Future" Pt.s 1 & 2, they had an English optical track but with large RED Japanese language sub-titles (if you can call them that, as they covered a 3rd of the screen area when anyone spoke). I also have had some really weird titles like the first "Nightmare On Elm Street", now you have got to remember all Airline titles were meant for general viewing, so imagine the horrible editing some of these had, but filmakers soon learnt, especially with nudity, as they filmed portions of their movies twice, once for the cinema (everything hanging out and on display), and once for the Airline / TV cut (Bra and top on etc.).
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Eberhard Nuffer
Expert Film Handler
Posts: 141
From: Stuttgart, Germany
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted August 01, 2005 04:08 PM
Hi altogether,
in Germany we have a nice quarterly on film collecting, MOVIE, published by the LUMIERE FILMCLUB. For about seven years now, in any issue of MOVIE one airline print has been reviewed. Among the prints reviewed, there were the following titles not included in the list yet:
1941 (Spielberg) D.A.R.Y.L. A Boy Named Charlie Brown Arthur Diamonds are Forever Fatal Attraction Good Morning Vietnam Never Cry Wolf Rear Window Seems Like Old Times Star Trek IV Swing Shift The Spy Who Loved Me The Untouchables Tootsie Trading Places Witness
I do have another airline print, "Yellowbeard" in my own collection. And, sorry to correct: Shouldn't the title "Lady in Red" read "Woman in Red" instead? (At least if you mean the Gene Wilder movie; I also have an airline print of this one).
I think the decision for optical sound instead of magnetic tracks had a lot to do with financial reasons: With optical prints, the soundtrack is copied in the same work step as the picture, whereas magnetic prints need a second run through a striping machine and a third run to record the sound information to the stripe.
Whereas in the field of amateur filmmakers, it was important to offer recording facilities, so projectors were designed for magnetic sound and the sound system of package movies was adapted to the existing "hardware", airlines had no need to adapt to the rest of the super 8 market: They had their own projection facilities for which the prints were struck, and as they had a lot of prints made, optical sound was considerably cheaper.
Best regards,
Eberhard
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted August 02, 2005 02:20 PM
How brown or pink? I've ran into a number of prints that are browning but quite nice. It wouldn't seem to be both brown and also pink, as pink denotes Eastman stock, brown denotes Kodak SP stock. In other words, is the color just fine with a slight browning, or color honestly gone bye bye/ I don't expect a virgin print, of course, but one that will still have a lot of mileage.
Your welcome to hotmail me. By the way, would you happen to have or know anyone who has "Never Cry Wolf" that they'd like to depart with ?
-------------------- "All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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Michael De Angelis
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1261
From: USA
Registered: Jul 2003
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posted August 03, 2005 03:15 PM
This is a wonderful posting about 8mm optical films.
It reminds me of my personal collection of optical prints, which stirs up memories of film friends that I have met along the way in life. These are friends that have shaped my appreciation of film, helping me build a collection, and which brings us together in this wonderful hobby.
I hope that this sentiment is appropriate for this posting, although the rest of this could probably be placed over by the General Yak Thread.
Anyway here's the story, it's about a film friend and his name was Arthur Stephan. He lived in Michigan, and was originally from New Jersey.
Arthur was a musician and collector, and he took pride in showcasing his films on a monthly basis to the public. His Silent Film Society in Ann Arbor, Michigan was well known for close to 30 years and it showcased mostly silent films which he either scored himself or obtained scored music from various sources.
Over time, Arthur decided to let go of some of his Standard 8mm and Super 8mm prints, all the while by managing to maintain his film society. As years past, it was more and more difficult to maintain a public space to showcase the films.
Over the last few years the wear and tear of searching and showcasing, albeit his poor health kept him going. Unfortunately his body could not keep up, and ultimately the Fox Theatre in Michigan also gave the society the boot out the door. Public sentiment in local news articles also tried to rally the continuation of the society in a public forum.
Well, he tried to maintain a good attitude about it, and although that the availability of space was not available, he had a good philosophy about not dying along with the society. He said that he could not die, because he still had so many bills to pay.
We spoke for many hours over the phone, and he would tell me that while growing up in N.J., the site of the Laurel and Hardy 'clothes tree' at the start of the beginning of a program, would alone have the audience cheering in hysterics.
Other nostalgic memories contain traveling to NYC's Capitol Theater for a full program of The Wizard of Oz, followed by a live stage show appearance with Judy Garland, Ray Bolger and Bert Lahr. Arthur said that he sat through the program twice that day.
(I relayed this story to my father-in-law, and he too saw Bob Hope and Pearl Bailey at the Capitol, after a screening of: That Certain Feeling. It was a time long ago, when Stars showcased their live talent after a full screening.)
Any way, Arthur always promised me a box of Super 8 Optical Features, only for the price of shipping.
Imagine that! He only needed to have a chance to find the time to ship it.
I never wished to press him about shipping it,due to his poor health because that was not important to me. But more importantly than receiving that package, I did receive a good friendship, but lost a good, kind and generous friend that had a storage of memories and was always cheerful to share a moment and chat about film. By all means, what's more important than that?
Essentially, that is what we are about.
I will never forget him, and his presence in me will live on forever. Thanks for allowing me to share this memory of Arthur and film, along with the good people here on the forum.
Michael
-------------------- Isn't it great that we can all communicate about this great hobby that we love!
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted August 03, 2005 06:15 PM
Hey Mike, did you ever find out what happened to his film collection? It's always sad to hear when, (as I did years ago) that a film collector passes on, leaves his collection to his ungrateful kids, who end up tossing them out or giving them to the salvation Army(who usually toss out those kind of things because there's no immediate "profit" to them) or whatever. It always burns me up. Someday, when I pass on, I will no doubt have found a good film friend who I can give my collection to who will value it, or mail out films others have envied, to those people that valued them, at least then, you know it'll go to someone who'll cherish them as you did!
-------------------- "All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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