8mm Forum


Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile | my password | register | search | faq | register | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» 8mm Forum   » 8mm Forum   » What is the worst scratching projector made? (Page 1)

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!  
This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2 
 
Author Topic: What is the worst scratching projector made?
Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 9948
From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted January 13, 2010 04:02 PM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
OK, this ought to be fun!

We've often talked about the kindest projectors to film, but what, in your opinion, is the absolute worst scratching projectors?

The "classic" projector, (I'll explain that later), would be the "Soundstar", it left deep scratches on me precious prints.
Sears projectors were pretty awful as well ...

but the worst all time "projector" I have ever ran into, was a little thing made near the end of Super 8, (classic era). It was a "Bentley" projector. It really wasn't an editor, as it had nothing to edit/plice with. I don't have a picture of it, but it was fashioned after the look of the portable TV's of the late 70's/early 80's. The top would open, and you would place in and thread a 200ft reel (it wouldn't take a 400ft reel) and you would watch the film on a little screen like an editor would have. It didn't use electricity, and you couldn't plug it in. It only took batteries. I suppose they marketed this as being handy. Perhaps you could take it to the mountians and watch movies?

Anyhow, this little projector that I bought scratched films in such a terrible way that I was completely astounded! TERRIBLE!

If anyone has a photo of it, please put it up?

--------------------
"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

 |  IP: Logged

Gian Luca Mario Loncrini
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1948
From: Verona (Italy)
Registered: Jan 2009


 - posted January 13, 2010 05:08 PM      Profile for Gian Luca Mario Loncrini   Author's Homepage   Email Gian Luca Mario Loncrini   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I can FOR SURE state the WORST one we had in Italy was the GIOCA ROYAL SOUND 50/N.

The perfect eating-film machine [Mad] . Loading the movie, you were not even sure if the take-up reel were in a position to make its job (only taking up to 200ft)!
Just joking, now, but this was for sure the WORST projector ever produced in Italy, referring to scratches.

Even less than a toy.

 -

 -

When I was 12 or 13 I had bought and re-sold it (how nasty I was to that poor buyer [Razz] ) in less than one week!

--------------------
I remember when I was (super) 8 years old...

 |  IP: Logged

John Almond
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 131
From: Wigan
Registered: Oct 2009


 - posted January 13, 2010 05:13 PM      Profile for John Almond   Email John Almond   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Is this the one Osi

 -

--------------------
"SARAH CONNOR?"
"No, she's just nipped to Sainsbury's. Do you want to come in and wait for her?"

 |  IP: Logged

Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 9948
From: #399R K.O.A. Mountian Home, ID. 83647
Registered: Jul 2005


 - posted January 13, 2010 05:55 PM      Profile for Osi Osgood   Author's Homepage   Email Osi Osgood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
AAAARG!

Yes! THAT'S the film violater!

--------------------
"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

 |  IP: Logged

Barry Attwood
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1356
From: Enfield, U.K.
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 01:37 AM      Profile for Barry Attwood   Email Barry Attwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well here in the U.K. (I can't say for the rest of the world) the product name CINEREX still makes me shiver, whatever model came out, they had terrible plastic pathways. I remember way back in 1978 when I was looking round for my first projector, I was shown this nice looking 8mm projector, he could see I might be interested, so he asked me if I would like a demonstration, and I said yes, of course. He had no used prints around, so he got a BRAND NEW & SEALED print of a "Mighty Mouse" cartoon off the shelf, run it through the machine, everything seemed to be going well with his sales pitch, then he said the unthinkable, would I like to see the projector running again, so after re-winding the film, he laced it up, and turned the machine on, and on the same print I had just watched were 2 THICK GREEN LINES down the centre of the picture, well at the time I might have been a bit naieve about 8mm, but not THAT NAIEVE not to see the green lines, and know something was very wrong, so I thanked him for his time, and made a swift exit right, if you know what I mean.

It's funny but my service agent reckons the motors on the CINEREX machines were one of the best made, shame about the rest of the machine!

 |  IP: Logged

Dino Everette
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1534
From: Long Beach, CA USA
Registered: Dec 2008


 - posted January 14, 2010 02:33 AM      Profile for Dino Everette   Email Dino Everette   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I love it Osi, the film eater is a Bentley [Razz]

I hate to say it and especially because of my love for the gauge and the fact that I have like 5 of these projectors but one of the worst offenders I have found might be the Pathe baby because of the rewind design..It seems a good number of the old cassettes have a couple of lines that perfectly match up with the edges on the rewind path..I think the first film I ever projected with one I rewound it and scratched it right off...

There are other 9.5 offenders like the Bolex G3 that if the film slips out of the sprocket, even one frame, it will proceed to gouge a line directly down the center of the reel....I have an otherwise gorgeous print of Vagabond Queen w/ Betty Balfour with aan entire first reel scratched down the middle..... [Frown]

--------------------
"You're too Far Out Miss Lawrence"

 |  IP: Logged

Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 4816
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 08:24 AM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I agree with Dino, Pathe Baby's can be 'reel' scratchers, but we love them anyway!. The brake arm on the Pathe Ace is also responsible for scratching probably thousands of 9.5mm reels, and Pathescope never fixed the problem (which would have been very simple to do) in the 30 year production run of that very popular machine! Pathe's in general are rough on film.
On the 8mm front, the worst scratcher I had was a late model Bell and Howell, although I forget which model it was - certainly NOT the great 606h/Regent

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

 |  IP: Logged

Guy Taylor, Jr.
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 606
From: Galveston, Texas, U.S.A.
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted January 14, 2010 08:56 AM      Profile for Guy Taylor, Jr.   Email Guy Taylor, Jr.   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
GAF dual 8 silent projector.

Other than my toy hand cranked Brumberger; this was the first projector I had as a kid. I purchased it because it was one of the least expensive ones on the market. It was proof that you get what you pay for.

--------------------
Guy Taylor

 |  IP: Logged

Chris Batt
Film Handler

Posts: 33
From: Northern Ireland Co. Tyrone
Registered: Dec 2009


 - posted January 14, 2010 10:06 AM      Profile for Chris Batt   Email Chris Batt   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hey guys n gals [Smile]

I have a Bolex SP8 that I bought via the dreaded e-bay ( [Frown] ) I am new to 8mm movies so I know as much about Projectors as I do the Vatican !! Any kind suggestions as to what Projector would be best for my treasured 8mm movies, and what price should I be looking to pay. My email is sanesurfer@msn.com I can be contacted here to.

Many thanks, Chris [Smile]

 |  IP: Logged

Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 12:03 PM      Profile for Mike Peckham   Email Mike Peckham   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Barry, I also had a Cinerex many years ago and it ruined several of my precious home movies before I realised what was happening. Everything that went through it ended up with scratches the length of the film! [Mad]

I remember the Chinon SP 330 had a reputation for scratching package movies but was fine with camera film. The problem was so bad that Derann reached the point where they wouldn't lend their library prints to anyone with an SP 330.

Chinon were asked to comment as the projector was a current and popular model at the time, they stated in Movie Maker that the tolerances of the gate (which I don't think was side sprung) were so tight that the variations in the width of package movies caused the film to bow in the gate and thus get scratched on it's way through.

Camera film however was fine because it was slit to much tighter tolerances.

Chris, personally I think that Sankyos are the make that have proved themselves kindest to films [Wink] .

Mike [Cool]

--------------------
Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...

 |  IP: Logged

Paul Adsett
Film God

Posts: 4816
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 12:12 PM      Profile for Paul Adsett     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've never owned a Sankyo Mike, but based on your comments over the years I would not hesitate to buy one. Eumig's are also very kind to film, I've never scratched a single frame with my many Eumigs. Can't say the same for the mighty GS1200 though, which definately is prone to scratching if not meticulously maintained. That's what I like about the Eumigs, they are very non-fussy and casual machines.

--------------------
The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj

 |  IP: Logged

Mike Peckham
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1461
From: West Sussex, UK.
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 12:23 PM      Profile for Mike Peckham   Email Mike Peckham   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Paul, I've never owned a Eumig but it is your comments on here over the years that have persuaded me that one day I should. Like you though, I have found that the GS 1200 needs careful watching in the film scratching department. I am fortunate in that one of my GS 1200s was 'modified' before I bought it, probably by Keith Wilton or David Locke and consequently has had all the potential scratch points eliminated. I still don't entirely trust it though...

Mike [Cool]

--------------------
Auntie Em must have stopped wondering where I am by now...

 |  IP: Logged

John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008


 - posted January 14, 2010 12:33 PM      Profile for John Davis   Email John Davis   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I echo the cinerex comment (I have previously called them Cine Wrecks). My Dad bought some projectors in an auction and these included a cinerex, my impression was it was a tidy looking machine - we tried to put a non-valuable film through it and it started to eat the film.
I gave it a new home immediately, the bin (there was no way I would pass this on).
I also had a go on a Raynox, which also scratched film - I'm reluctant to blame the machine as it had obviously had a lot of abuse. It's performance otherwise was below average anyway

 |  IP: Logged

Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5415
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 01:38 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean   Email Winbert Hutahaean   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would really want to have that Bentley...installed in my Van. [Wink]

Other person will be surprised if knowing a reel is used to play the film.

What do you think? combination between modern car and old technology.

rgds,

--------------------
Winbert

 |  IP: Logged

Del Phillipson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 641
From: Derbyshire, England
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted January 14, 2010 01:42 PM      Profile for Del Phillipson   Email Del Phillipson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's Cinerex for me, I bought one when I first started work, it got sent back about 4 times before I gave up and got a refund, not before it annihilated my king kong 200" (at the time was my pride and joy) Then bought a trusty Eumig, what a great little machine that was. Del.

 |  IP: Logged

Dino Everette
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1534
From: Long Beach, CA USA
Registered: Dec 2008


 - posted January 14, 2010 01:45 PM      Profile for Dino Everette   Email Dino Everette   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
But winbert why would you want to install a "one and done" projector anywhere [Eek!] You'd have to keep replacing the films you screened.

--------------------
"You're too Far Out Miss Lawrence"

 |  IP: Logged

Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5415
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 02:33 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean   Email Winbert Hutahaean   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I know Dino....

It is similar to my other idea to place 8 track in my van.

I like just anything weird [Wink]

(ps: do you know that there was actually a turntable player for car. It used 7" record. I found one in the internet but I never got one in reality. I'd like to have that one too [Big Grin] )

cheers,

--------------------
Winbert

 |  IP: Logged

Den Brown
Master Film Handler

Posts: 270
From: London, UK
Registered: Apr 2007


 - posted January 14, 2010 03:13 PM      Profile for Den Brown   Email Den Brown   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No competition: Cinewrecks.

 |  IP: Logged

Darren Payne
Film Handler

Posts: 46
From: Bournemouth
Registered: Mar 2009


 - posted January 14, 2010 03:37 PM      Profile for Darren Payne   Email Darren Payne   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My dads girlfriend a few years back put 2 nice green lines my new print of Q the Winged Serpent on her CHINNON. UGH!

 |  IP: Logged

Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5415
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 04:26 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean   Email Winbert Hutahaean   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
My dads girlfriend a few years back put 2 nice green lines my new print of Q the Winged Serpent on her CHINNON. UGH!
Darren, did you decide to break up with her?

You should... [Big Grin]

cheers,

--------------------
Winbert

 |  IP: Logged

Bill Phelps
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1454
From: USA
Registered: Jan 2009


 - posted January 14, 2010 05:43 PM      Profile for Bill Phelps     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Winbert...how can Darren break up with his dad's girlfriend?

Bill

 |  IP: Logged

Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5415
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 14, 2010 06:50 PM      Profile for Winbert Hutahaean   Email Winbert Hutahaean   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
whooops my brain is faster than my eyes,

I thought Darren wrote "My girlfriend's dad..."

sorry...

(if you know, as Indonesian, we are writing the opposite, similar to French)

OK Darren, did you ask your Dad to break up with her.... [Big Grin]

cheers,

--------------------
Winbert

 |  IP: Logged

Bill Phelps
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1454
From: USA
Registered: Jan 2009


 - posted January 14, 2010 07:14 PM      Profile for Bill Phelps     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No problem...just wanted to clarify!

As for this topic I would have to agree with Guy.

GAF dual 8 silent projector from around 1967. Mom and Dad bought with camera to film the new family...me! I still have for sentimental reasons but man did I tear up some of the family films as well as my own stuff I shot as a teenager. It's hard to see what's going on under the scratches on some of 'em. Although I wasn't cleaning the film path to much either so some of it is my fault!

Bill

 |  IP: Logged

Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 497
From: Dallas, TX, USA
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 15, 2010 12:41 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
My parents bought a Montgomery Ward dual-8 silent projector to show home movies they shot in the late 60s. That projector was comprised of one item...the claw to pull down each frame one after another. That was it! No sprockets, no rollers!

ALL of the family's home movies are insanely scratched to hell and back up until the time I got into 8mm and got a Chinon silent dual-8 for Christmas at some young age. The Montgomery Ward projector was retired at that point, and oddly enough the scratching stopped.

I found a picture on the web:
 -

Here is the link with more pictures of the monster.

 |  IP: Logged

Kevin Faulkner
Film God

Posts: 4071
From: Essex UK
Registered: Jun 2003


 - posted January 15, 2010 03:47 AM      Profile for Kevin Faulkner         Edit/Delete Post 
That looks like a Gioca Silent which was another right royal horror. Look at the similarity between this and the sound version at the top of this thread.

Kev.

--------------------
GS1200 Xenon with Elmo 1.0...great combo along with a 16-CL Xenon for that super bright white light.

 |  IP: Logged



All times are Central
This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2 
 
Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic    next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:

Visit www.film-tech.com for free equipment manual downloads. Copyright 2003-2019 Film-Tech Cinema Systems LLC

Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2