8mm Forum: Different kinds of picture deterioration

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Topic: Different kinds of picture deterioration

Ronald Kwiatkowski
Film Handler

Posts: 67
From: Luxemburg
Registered: Nov 2012

posted November 26, 2012 12:59 PM

Hi again, newbie's question,

can anybody give me a quick overlook about the different forms of picture deterioration? If I understand correctly, there are mainly 3 kinds:
- cyan dye failure, which gives you a more or less red print, probably depending on storage conditions
- general fade of all colors, resulting in a pale or brownish picture (not sure on this one)
- vinegar syndrome, which gives you a mess, you can't use, right?

I may be wrong on the details... please enlighten me... also, which stocks are likely to be faulty? I seem to read that "LPP" is the best, the most stable? If I read "low fade" somewhere, does that mean the print is a bit faded, or is "low fade" a stock designation?

Thanks an awful lot [Smile]

Ronny

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Vinegar belongs in the salad...

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Matt McBride
Film Handler

Posts: 62
From: Starkville, MS USA
Registered: Oct 2012

posted November 26, 2012 03:11 PM

You are right about the cyan dye failure. General fading in all colors can be attributed to its age or what type of stock it was printed on. The processing it went through. There are a lot of variables for this one. You can still run a print that has VS. It just depends how bad it is and how warped the print is. The only caution is isolating VS prints from healthy prints and if you run a VS print, then make sure to give the projector a good clean down before running a healthy print. When you see "low fade" it means the movie was printed on a stock that is less likely to fade than others. LPP is one of the notable stocks that tends to fade less.

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Ronald Kwiatkowski
Film Handler

Posts: 67
From: Luxemburg
Registered: Nov 2012

posted November 26, 2012 04:34 PM

Thank you, Matt, much obliged.

Concerning cyan dye, I had this idea to look up a local seller of color filters for Disco lighting. There are dozens of cyan filters in different saturation, some are near to transparent. As they're quite cheap (about 1€ a sheet), I'm considering buying a whole set of different "cyan strengths", since the problem occurs in different ways. I shall post my experience as I happen to fall on such prints. First film I received was a 200ft "Black Hole" that I suspected to be very reddish at the naked eye, but then I found out there's just an awful lot of red stuff in the movie itself [Smile]

I would say the actual cyan dye is mild, faces look a tad pink...

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Vinegar belongs in the salad...

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Hugh Thompson Scott
Film God

Posts: 3063
From: Gt. Clifton,Cumbria,England
Registered: Jan 2012

posted November 27, 2012 05:40 AM

Hi Ronald, that's exactly the solution I use on faded prints,As for
fading film stocks, just about every film stock will, in the fullness
of time, it's just a case of when.

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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God

Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003

posted November 27, 2012 11:44 AM

quote:
Concerning cyan dye, I had this idea to look up a local seller of color filters for Disco lighting.

Ronald, although it is only EURO 1, if you have to buy all color filters to check the most suitable ones it will cost you some money.

Someone at Ebay is selling this type of filter ready to use for $16.95 (for 3 filter with different level). I bought it and it works well for film with a little fade.

Here is his completed listing (but you can contact directly the seller for buying off Ebay)

COLOR CORRECTION FILTER STOCK

Douglas also has purchased the more expensive filter ones from Wittner and has written the review here:

Product Review: Color Rebalance Filter

From his screen shots I can say that the money spent for Wittner filter (119,83 EUR) gives almost the same result with the one I bought for $16.95.

Another thread about this can also be read here:

Colour Correction filters

and

Anyone use a filter for faded prints?

cheers,

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Winbert

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Ronald Kwiatkowski
Film Handler

Posts: 67
From: Luxemburg
Registered: Nov 2012

posted November 27, 2012 07:23 PM

Thanks for the info... I wasn't gonna buy 50 filters, but I thought I'd try with, say, a dozen, I can budget that [Smile]

gonna try local sellers though, of course... I read the thread about the Wittner filter, which is rather expensive and may be too cyan for many prints that have only a slight red tint... anyways, as I make experience, I will post results...

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Vinegar belongs in the salad...

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