8mm Forum: Splicers? Tape? Cement? Pros? Cons?

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Topic: Splicers? Tape? Cement? Pros? Cons?

Lee Bombard
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 139
From: Santa Clarita, CA, USA
Registered: May 2013

posted June 07, 2013 01:47 PM

I'm curious what this forums highly informed members think about splicers?
I'll have my projector in a few days and thought it'd be a good idea to have a good splicer ready at hand before I start running any film...

Thoughts?

Thanks,
Lee

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 07, 2013 01:52 PM

I learned early, tape is safer. If you have polyester print, it won't splice with cement. Tape works for all it seems.

I do like the Super 8 part of the Kodak Splicer, but not the 16mm part of it. The Super 8 is doing a straight cut, so you lose the least frames. The 16mm and Regular 8 on it is doing a half curve (I am not too good with the english language, but that's the closest I could think of)

I have both cement and tape, but use the tapes 99% of the time

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Lee Bombard
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 139
From: Santa Clarita, CA, USA
Registered: May 2013

posted June 07, 2013 03:06 PM

Thanks Vidar. Would you recommend the Kodak tape splicer for Super 8? Are there various Kodak tape splicers?

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Maurizio Di Cintio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 977
From: Ortona, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004

posted June 08, 2013 08:48 AM

I use tape to assemble commercial prints prior to screening, so that I can disassemble all the reels and put them back onto their spools without losong a single frame; and I use cement splicers for my own home-produced films: I like the idea that film, in this way, sort of tends to be a single piece of film. My splicer of choice is a bevel edge one, namely the Hahnel Kollmatic: I use this brand to scrape the film ends prior to cementing, but I then use a Bolex cement splicer to hold the termonals in place and proceed with the edit: it's more precise.

--------------------
Maurizio

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 08, 2013 08:57 AM

Urbanski Films have this Kodak splicer new and I am happy to have bought it. I bought three on eBay, all with their problems. The new one is really good though. Problem with the first three was one had a broken pin (another one brole a little later), the two others were not firm in the springs that presses the film outwards to keep it in place. It's not too bad, can be used, but the new one is keeping the film where it's suppose to be.

http://moviecraft.tripod.com/supplies.html

I checked now, seems he is out of new ones :-( I was considering getting one more. You could ask him if the springs are firm before ordering though?

Good luck and YES, I would recommend it for Super 8. I use it for 16mm also, but losing unnecessary frames isn't optimal

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Richard Bock
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 239
From: El Cerrito,CA,USA
Registered: Jan 2010

posted June 08, 2013 09:08 AM

I like cement for 16mm and 8mm. much cheaper and efficient. I also like the handmade nature of it. Problem with cement is that you lose a frame. For the hobby of small formats it's ideal for me. For Super 8 I use a Ciro tape splice.

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 08, 2013 09:36 AM

I've bought several old, used 16mm prints with cement splices ... They mostly tend to break off when rewinding ... Is this just due to bad splicing or will the cement give way after many years? This is also one of the reasons I like tape (if proper tape is used, gotten loads of movies with stretched normal tape, hate that)

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Richard Bock
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 239
From: El Cerrito,CA,USA
Registered: Jan 2010

posted June 08, 2013 10:35 AM

Something really old will break especially under the strain of tight rewind . tape splices can also yellow and go brittle with age. for me the big plus is that my splices should last 20 years, and that's about my range. If one doesn't do a cement splice well it can break. Important to get ALL the emulsion off on the target frame.

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted June 08, 2013 12:13 PM

I do the same as Richard in having both cement and tape splicers. Cement with acetate film is more economical than tape. However sometimes tape works better especially to repair one or two broken sprocket holes.

Here are a couple splicing tutorials I made:

Kodak Universal Splicer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7svDF_Gc8pk

3-Way Cement Splicer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s_kB2_C668

PM me...I have one of each to sell.

Janice

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Lee Bombard
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 139
From: Santa Clarita, CA, USA
Registered: May 2013

posted June 08, 2013 12:15 PM

Thanks all for this great information.
I'll probably go with a tape splicer. Are they pretty much all alike or are there advantages and disadvantages to different brands?

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Richard Bock
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 239
From: El Cerrito,CA,USA
Registered: Jan 2010

posted June 08, 2013 01:30 PM

That's right Janice, tape is better for torn sprockets. I have that splicer you have on your cool tutorials or one that looks just like it. A cool li'l splicer.

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 08, 2013 02:09 PM

Hello to all forums, i'm an italian fan! [Smile]

So... you recommended a universal splicer useful for both 8mm for 9.5mm or is it better to take them separate?

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 08, 2013 02:32 PM

I am happy with my Kodak Splicer for use on Regular, Super 8 and 16mm. No 9.5 though. Cause no problem for me at least with all in one.

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 08, 2013 04:09 PM

I've seen, even on this forum, that there would be Marguet Tri-film, for 8, 9.5, 16mm, but I did not understand if it is to glue or tape, and glue that you should buy.

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 08, 2013 04:14 PM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/kevp/3394649043/

Look very cement to me, if this is the one you refer to

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 08, 2013 05:51 PM

Yes, it is a cement: http://www.cinematheque-normandie.fr/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/DSC0084.jpg
Internet speak well to him (although I would have preferred to tape), you may go.
Can anyone tell me where to buy the cement for this machine?

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Vidar Olavesen
Film God

Posts: 2232
From: Sarpsborg, Norway
Registered: Nov 2012

posted June 08, 2013 06:42 PM

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HAMA-CINE-FILM-CEMENT-ACETATE-GLUE-WET-SPLICING-PRO-NEW-/200637658467?pt=UK_Photography_DarkroomSupplies_SM&hash=item2eb6efb563

Should work I believe?

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 08, 2013 07:23 PM

Definitely! [Smile]

We can understand, perhaps with someone who is in possession, if this splicer, as well as paste, also makes the cutting operation?

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Maurizio Di Cintio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 977
From: Ortona, Italy
Registered: Jan 2004

posted June 09, 2013 03:53 AM

ALL splicers prepare the film ends to splicing: regardless their being wet or tape splicers, the film ends are trimmed and, in the case of wet ones, they are scraped in order to make matt the area which is to be spliced.

The only exception is the Hamann "Filmspalter" which is only a cutter: it cuts both film ends creating a bevel edge which makes it possible to overlap the two pieces of film to join without encrease the total thickness. Then you need a regular wet splicer of the Hamann splicer to complete the operation.

--------------------
Maurizio

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 09, 2013 07:58 AM

Hi Maurizio,
Thank you for explanation!

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 525
From: Dallas, TX, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted June 09, 2013 11:28 AM

My favorite Super 8 splicer was the Wurker. Is tape even available for that anymore?

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 09, 2013 12:29 PM

Hi Brad,
particularly as a method and the design, I have to do a search if there is also 8mm.

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Adrian Winchester
Film God

Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004

posted June 10, 2013 08:17 PM

I'm sure Wurker tape is still available - CHC generally have it. I use a Wurker for S8 and I think you can't beat it. I use proper Wurker splices for stereo films or anywhere the splice could show on screen, but I also have some cheap 'wrap around' type splices that I use if I'm (e.g.) splicing on some leader.

--------------------
Adrian Winchester

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Luigi Castellitto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 715
From: Campobasso, Italy
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 11, 2013 07:22 AM

If it were for regular 8mm or 9,5mm, or together, would be interesting.

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Robert Crewdson
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1031
From: UK
Registered: Jun 2013

posted June 26, 2013 07:34 AM

I have never had much success with wet splicing, I don't know what I am doing wrong. I have an Agfa Super 8 tape splicer, and when I got into 16mm I bought a Kodak Presstape splicer off Ebay. Don't like the fact that the cut is curved as someone else mentioned. I haven't found the tapes as good as the Kodak originals. I also have a lovely boxed Premier splicer from 1954. Back to super 8; I used to wonder if over time the tape would discolour or lose it adhesive qualities, but I have never had any problems.

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