8mm Forum: Jumpy image on Elmo FP-A

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Topic: Jumpy image on Elmo FP-A

Lilah Gillis
Junior
Posts: 2
From: Yankton, SD, USA
Registered: Nov 2015

posted November 16, 2015 07:45 PM

Hello! Trying to convert Dad's 8mm films to digital, but the picture keeps jumping. I've found the slider to adjust where the top of the frame is, and Dad said the jumpiness can be fixed by the button at the top...I see that it has a slight effect, but does not fix the problem. Any ideas about what's wrong?

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted November 16, 2015 10:29 PM

Hi Lilah...Try these initial trouble-shooting steps to see if there is any improvement.

1) Check and make sure the gate (where the film passes past the frame opening) is clean and clear of any sticky residue. Clean with alcohol.

2) Check that the claw (little wire-like pin that pulls the film sprockets down) does not have any fuzz on it.

3) Check that you have the projector set to the correct film format (Super 8 or Regular 8).

4) Check that the sprocket holes in the film are in good condition. Test other reels to compare if some run smoother than others.

5) The button at the top is used to reset the upper loop...Push the botton down and let it quickly pop back up on it's own to restore the loop.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Lilah Gillis
Junior
Posts: 2
From: Yankton, SD, USA
Registered: Nov 2015

posted November 21, 2015 01:53 PM

Thanks, Janice. Must be the sprocket holes. I tried another few reels, and they're fine. I do need to get some canned air and do a cleaning.

The one giving me trouble was several Dad spliced together. Would that contribute to the problem or just a coincidence? I've just done the single-sized films since.

Also, after about 30 minutes of run time, the light quits. Then the next day it's fine. Do you suppose it's just heat?

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted November 25, 2015 01:40 PM

Hi Lilah...Indeed bad or frequent splices can cause the film to lose it's loop which in turn will make the film jump in the gate. As far as the lamp going out after 30 mins... I'm not sure. Perhaps one of our electrical gurus here on the forum can venture a guess. It's possible the bulb is going bad and those bulbs are pretty expensive to replace.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Phil Mitchell
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 144
From: Melbourne, Australia
Registered: Aug 2013

posted December 16, 2015 02:06 AM

Hi Janice and trust all is well.

Read this with interest, I now have two FP-A duel formats, using one for spare parts. Although in regards to those spur gears, I managed to mold my own, when required, what was missing on first FP-a was the sticker on Light Cover, that one needs to turn inching knob a bit while changing formats, if not the teeth can break. We live and learn, anyway back to question.

You mention a Pin, to grab film, now I know my other Elmo, one without auto threading has this, as you helped me with that while back, but I cannot see same thing in both FP-a's, but both have had same issue, this bit of wire showing up while projecting and also shreading film sprockets. I gather it was this pin, any chance you could take a picture of what it looks like and post back.

The 2nd FP-A I got cheap, has a slow speed slot switch, ever seen one with it, strange option when it has a variable speed motor.

Anyway thanks in advance

Phil

How's your Sankyo, any change?

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted December 16, 2015 11:27 AM

Phil... I was just talking about the "claw" and trying to describe what it would look like to a novice projector owner. If your projector doesn't have a claw...that would be bad [Eek!]

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Phil Mitchell
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 144
From: Melbourne, Australia
Registered: Aug 2013

posted December 19, 2015 12:06 AM

Hi Janice, thanks for reply,

By Claw do you mean the two pins as per Photo below where Red arrow is pointing?

As the FPA's I have don't have them, this picture is from the Elmo that doesn't have the Auto heading option, the one that has to be hand fed.

Actually I noticed on both FPA's what I assume is the heat shield, this circular part with clear plastic glass in it and has a lever that goes into middle of units, it doesn't move be unit running on fwd etc or in still mode.

Cheers
Phil

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Steve Snyder
Junior
Posts: 14
From: Woodinville, WA, USA
Registered: Dec 2015

posted December 19, 2015 09:27 AM

I'm following this too. I got an FP-A off of eBay and it worked fine for a couple of reels of film then started getting all gittery on me. I'm somewhat handy but I am not going to spend hours tearing down this machine and trying to fix it. I have miles of film I want to watch that my father took of us growing up and I am going to try and convert it to digital.

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Barry Fritz
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1061
From: Burnsville, MN, USA
Registered: Dec 2009

posted December 19, 2015 11:17 AM

Phil:
Yes, that is the "claw" Janice was referring to. It is also called the "intermittent" or sometimes the "pulldown". It is a necessary part of all movie projectors.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted December 19, 2015 02:46 PM

As with any projector, claw penetration has to be set to an actual optimum position to ensure you can run thicker acetate prints just as well and as quietly as you can run much thinner polyester prints through the very same machine.

The stability of your image plus accurate framing can depend very much on this setting.

Out by even 0.5mm and the results can be alarming, from noisy on acetate at best to jittery on Ester.

It really is a critical optimum setting to perfect but once the "sweet spot" is found, The results make you believe you just purchased a brand new machine all over again in many many cases.

It is only in extreme cases that cam or claw wear will not permit the optimum setting position to be found.

Wear or lack of decent healthy lubricant to any of these components of any notoriety, will result in adjustment having to be made to make the machine run well again.

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted December 19, 2015 03:16 PM

What you say Andrew is so true about the claw adjustment. I have done claw adjustments on 3 Sankyo projectors. One wouldn't feed film at all and the other two had the jitters. Once adjusted correctly...like you said...they ran like new machines.

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted December 19, 2015 04:41 PM

Just like with our car valves, if these machines were reinvented today, no doubt, some genius would have come up with the solution to make projector claw self adjust.

However they WERE made in the 70's and 80's (Super 8 sound machines) and as such, just like the motor car counterparts, it all relies on us, the human beings, having the wisdom to know when to intervene, and what to do when we do!

[ December 20, 2015, 07:20 AM: Message edited by: Andrew Woodcock ]

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Phil Mitchell
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 144
From: Melbourne, Australia
Registered: Aug 2013

posted December 28, 2015 01:29 AM

Hi all and thanks for replies ( Merry Christmas Happy New year to you all)

Yep Claws are there although one only has one pin, hmm, but one machine needs realignment, which by memory I did with the first Elmo I got which is the non auto thread model, by adjusting the manual wind knob, it shouldn't move side to side. That made claw pins to grab film better.

Cheers

Phil

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