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Topic: noob question small picture ?

Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 16, 2018 05:30 PM

hi, sorry for this but.. why is the picture so small on my Bell and Howell filmosound 16mm PJ ? i thought it would be bigger, but it seems smaller even than my 8mm PJ ?
cheers rob

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Nantawat Kittiwarakul
Master Film Handler

Posts: 280
From: Rajburana, Bangkok, Thailand
Registered: Aug 2017

posted September 16, 2018 08:17 PM

If the projection lens is standard 50mm,then there would be no surprise at all. [Wink]

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Just a lone collector from a faraway land...

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Terry Sills
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1423
From: Weymouth,Dorset,England
Registered: Oct 2012

posted September 17, 2018 01:20 AM

If a long throw lens is fitted then it would also account for a small picture. 50mm is the standard lens, anything over 50mm would be considered a long throw.
What distance from projector to screen are you using?

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 17, 2018 02:43 AM

it is about 15 ft from the screen, so not far.
could i fit another lens, or adapt the one i have to give a larger picture ?
thanks Rob

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Robert Crewdson
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1031
From: UK
Registered: Jun 2013

posted September 17, 2018 03:25 AM

You need to look for a one inch, or 25mm lens, this will fill your screen the same as your 8mm projector. The 50mm lens was standard because many of these projectors were used in halls where the distance from the screen was longer than in the home.

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 17, 2018 03:48 AM

Rob
If your picture is 2'9" x 2'1" at a 15ft throw, then you have the standard 2" (50mm) lens.
To increase picture size have a longer throw or invest in a shorter focal length lens.
What model is your Bell & Howell?
The earlier wooden blimp models used lenses of a smaller barrel size than the later models. Don't get confused if you go into the market for a new lens.

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Maurice

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 17, 2018 04:14 AM

I see chaps it is not a huge issue i was just wondering really, although a bigger picture would be nice.. i am maybe a bit spoiled by the 120" screen i use with my JVC X30 [Cool]

Maurice, i have the Bell & Howell FILMOSOUND 1592,
thanks Rob

[ September 17, 2018, 07:24 AM: Message edited by: Robert Blackie ]

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 17, 2018 05:02 AM

Rob
Paul Foster has three lenses to fit your Bell & Howell, all at £79.99.
38mm
40mm
Zoom 35mm to 65mm
If you are interested I would recommend the zoom.
Remember that short focal length lenses are much sought after and their price reflects this.
http://www.fosterfilms.co.uk/accessories.htm

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Maurice

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Melvin England
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 707
From: Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Feb 2016

posted September 17, 2018 05:07 AM

Robert - Sorry to sort of gate-crash your post, but on this topic I need to ask Maurice a question which I am sure would benefit both of us...

Maurice - I, too, have a Bell & Howell 16mm Filmosound with a 50mm lens. A few years ago I picked up a zoom lens at Blackpool which has focal lengths between 32mm and 65mm. Naturally, I DO get a much bigger picture. BUT (and pardon my ignorance to this basic question) is it the 32mm or the 65mm end that makes it a bigger picture?

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"My name is for my friends!"

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 17, 2018 06:38 AM

im guessing the 32 [Big Grin]

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Brian Fretwell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1785
From: London, UK
Registered: Jun 2014

posted September 17, 2018 06:40 AM

I'm not Maurice, but it is the 32mm that gives the bigger picture.

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Melvin England
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 707
From: Hull, East Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Feb 2016

posted September 17, 2018 07:29 AM

Thanks Brian. Hope that also helped you Robert.
I kind of did have an ulterior motive for finding out, as even using this lens does not fill my entire screen as my super 8 lenses do from the same distance, so I need to be on the lookout for a lens that is less than 32mm if one exists.

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"My name is for my friends!"

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 17, 2018 08:25 AM

Agreed. The 32mm end gives the bigger picture.
The Super 8 range of projectors with their zoom lenses were mainly designed for use in a home environment, whilst the 16mm range were designed for use in larger auditoria.

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Maurice

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David Guest
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1704
From: Lancashire, UK
Registered: Oct 2011

posted September 17, 2018 09:30 AM

I can sell you a zoom lens to fit this machine with good clean optics I might even have a 25mm or a 38mm will take a look and it will be a lot cheeper than anyone else on here

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 17, 2018 09:37 AM

The modern Bell & Howell range of lenses go down to 1" (25mm), this lens will give a picture 5'7" x 4'2" at a throw of 15ft.

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Maurice

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 17, 2018 11:48 AM

Hi David thanks, PM me please (*i assume you can do that here ).
thanks rob

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Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003

posted September 17, 2018 04:12 PM

Go for at least a 25mm Robert, if you can, or even better a 16mm Elmo 1.4 20mm lens, superb, and releeve it for the B+H easy enough as its 40mm in size and the bell and howell is 52.5mm I think.

But a good 25mm may be just the job.

Though a good Elmo 20mm is fantastic.

Mine off David Guest ( thanks David ) is just brilliant.

Best wishes Mark.

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 20, 2018 09:18 AM

thanks for the info Mark [Smile]

just waiting on a PM.
Rob
edit
i picked up a 16mm Bell & Howell 2 inch f1.2 for cheap, it looks like it might fit ok.. il let you know when it comes.
BTW my current lens is 2 inch / 51mm f/1.2
looks very similar in size/ threads etc. fingers crossed it gives a bigger picture [Smile]

it says 16mm but i doubt thats the focal length.. probably referring to 16mm pj.. [Confused]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bell-Howell-Projector-Lens-16-mm-2-inch-f-1-2-Made-in-the-USA/253872870722?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2648

[ September 20, 2018, 03:25 PM: Message edited by: Robert Blackie ]

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 20, 2018 06:51 PM

anyone ?
cheers rob [Smile]

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Nantawat Kittiwarakul
Master Film Handler

Posts: 280
From: Rajburana, Bangkok, Thailand
Registered: Aug 2017

posted September 20, 2018 09:33 PM

So you're replacing the original 51mm lens with 2" lens??? [Confused]

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Just a lone collector from a faraway land...

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 21, 2018 02:23 AM

Rob
You are replacing like for like. Or, am I missing something?

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Maurice

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 21, 2018 03:46 AM

i have no idea, thats why im asking lol
i assumed 16mm was the focal length..it seems odd to print 16mm on the lens otherwise.. also there are no other numbers except the aperture, all the other lenses i have seen have an actual number like 32,38, 40 etc, this does not.
and i assumed the 2 in was the fit size..
ah well, you live and learn.
i have asked he seller to cancel sale, il just wait now, see if he does.
cheers rob

[ September 21, 2018, 04:58 AM: Message edited by: Robert Blackie ]

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Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003

posted September 21, 2018 03:52 AM

Hi Rob, yes it will be the same size.

You really need a 25mm or so.

Can you exlain you need a different one to the seller, they should be undertstanding that you are new to it etc.

There are good options etc, keep with it, and the bigger picture will work wonders for enjoying the films.

Look forward to it.

Best Mark.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/16mm-projection-lens-Bell-and-Howell-Extremely-Rare-25mm-Wide-Angle-Fits-TQs/142915366888?hash=item21466b6fe8:g:i94AAOSwfBFbgBHY

This is right but you should get one for around £50/£60 did you speak to David Guset. hes also a good source to get a few nice cheap bits to get you going etc.

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Robert Blackie
Film Handler

Posts: 34
From: Glasgow, Scotland
Registered: Aug 2018

posted September 21, 2018 04:09 AM

hi mark, yes i see, no i have not spoken to David as he has not PM'ed me yet, so i just sent him a PM.
it is not something im willing to pay £100 on TBH, even £50 seems steep.. i suppose because i have a regular video projector and also a working 8mm / super8 ..also, the thing about old cine stuff i have noticed is, on 8mm you cant really play feature films, and on 16mm, the full length movies are ridiculously expensive !
and a lot of sellers seem pretty greedy asking the earth ...

im more into looking at 8mm and super 8 home movies and the laurel and hardy/chaplin type thing..this is due to the fact that the only 8mm/s8 films are "selected scenes" from movies but people still want quite a lot for them.. looking at it , a full length move on s8 would be about 5 reels long..ive never seen these for sale.

16mm is a bit of a bust for me, i got the PJ cheap but getting any decent film is proving to be a bit of a hike... so spending much on a lens for the 16mm PJ is not really justifiable.
saw pulp fiction going for over 3k last time i looked [Eek!]

cheers rob

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Maurice Leakey
Film God

Posts: 5895
From: Bristol. United Kingdom
Registered: Oct 2007

posted September 21, 2018 06:24 AM

The eBay ad was a trifle misleading, and the pics were not very clear. I suppose the seller put 16mm to show it was a lens for a 16mm projector.
The lens is/was the standard lens as supplied with the projector from new, usually referred to as a 2" (inch), but sometimes quoted as a 50mm.
Either way, it's the same.

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Maurice

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