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Topic: The Battle For Buhl Continues! Follow Up

Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 14, 2008 04:13 PM

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No response from Dave Thomas in regard's to the $300.00 Buhl scope lens kit. Why it would not work. Silence tell's me a lot!!! I did not expect compensation from Dave but an explanation would have been nice! Larry Racies tried it out and it would not work. I refunded Larry's money. We both lost $12.00 postage on this. I appreciated Larry's patience.

I sent the lens kit to Steve Osborne to check it out. He said it would not work and he could not re-sell it either. He was going to give me a $15.00 credit for the "This Is Scope" test film toward's an LPP 16mm TV movie print of "Fire" produced by Irwin Allen in 1977. No word from Steve at all now. I sent him the instructions for the len's from Dave Thomas that I found. No word as to whether or not the instruction's helped him use the lens or not. Fifteen days have passed! No returned phone call's, No e-mail's, No 16mm film!!! What kind of way is that to do business? I can't imagine my good friend the late Derek Simmonds at Derann Film Services conducting business that way. Derek had INTEGRITY!!!

Look's like the battle is over and I lost!!! Big time too!!! Not a happy camper here!!!

--TP [Frown]

[Frown]

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted May 14, 2008 06:40 PM

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Tom,

Not too make excuses, but please keep in mind that Steve runs The Reel Image in his spare time. He does have a full time job that demands most of his attention, and last time we spoke he mentioned how he has boxes and boxes of a recently acquired film collection that he needs to inventory. To save customers money on shipping costs, he often ships media mail, which does take longer to arrive. That said, I hope you get a reply and your film soon.

Doug

--------------------
I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 14, 2008 07:13 PM

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Hi Doug:

I know that Steve is busy but it only takes a couple of seconds to send a very short e-mail. I am giving him the len's kit and he was going to give me a small amount of credit for the test film I sent. I hope that the 16mm print of "Fire" is on LPP. I have "Flood" on LPP stock. I just want some kind of short response. It's coming up on three week's soon. If he did send the print out then yes media mail is slow. I just want some closure on this entire nightmare. No, Doug you are not making up excuses. I know what you are doing. You are fronting for both Dave and Steve!!! [Smile]

[Smile]

No, just kidding Doug!!! I will try my best to be patient. I really think it's ALL over. The reality is sinking in now!!!

Your Friend,

--Tom

P.S. Tom Snyder on NBC used to say "the opera ain't over until the fat lady sing's". Well truthfully I think she has sung.

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Tony Stucchio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 625
From: New Jersey
Registered: Dec 2005

posted May 14, 2008 07:36 PM

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I bought a loaf of bread from the supermarket 11 years ago. I tried to eat it last night, but it is hard. I brought it back to the supermarket today and they wouldn't take it back. Boy, am I mad. I will never buy anything from them again!

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Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 14, 2008 08:29 PM

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Hey Tony:

Bad analogy! You are talking about a "cheap" disposable perishable food item with an expiration date. A scope lens, bracket, stand, and test film are NOT perishable items. The len's kit should work just as properly now as when I shelled out the $300.00! Also bread does NOT cost $300.00 per loaf. I am not asking for compensation after all these year's from Dave. Just an explanation as to why this lens was inferior to begin with. Why I got a Buhl kit instead of a Kowa kit.

--TP

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted May 14, 2008 10:24 PM

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If I may speak up for Tom, as I have gotten to know him over a good while, he's really been stung by this whole ordeal, and I can understand.

I still sting when my second and third super 8 buys were complete rip-offs!

One was a fellow over in Britain who I paid 300.00 dollars to for print of Star Wars scope. never got the film, and when I contacted him about perhaps giving half the money back, he flatly refused. For all i know, he never sent it out in the first place! All I knew is that I was out 300.00 plus dollars.

The next one was a fellow in Austrailia, from whom I bought a print of Laurel and Hardy's "Pack Up Your Troubles" and "Blockheads", as well as a print of "Creature From the Black Lagoon, 400ft. 3D", that was 150.00 dollars. I never received them. i would have never thought that I would get stung literally a month and a half after the Star Wars debacle.

Thankfully, it didn't totally end up turning me completely off from buying from overseas, but then a number of times, I have been ripped off by dealers from the UK whgo promised great color on prints, and they have been far from that, or even sending a title that I didn't order, and hell, it's a good 50.00 or more dollars to send the unwanted prints back!

(Please note: Derann, CHC and Barry Atwood at Independent 8 are not among the scumbags!)

So Tom, you have my sympathies! No one likes getting ripped off, however, I reiterate, I know Steve Osbourne to be an honorable dealer and, as Doug stated, he is incredibly busy with job, "reel Image" magazine AND all the prints he works with. I'm sure that there must be some very legitimate reason why he hasn't been able to get back to you.

--------------------
"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Larry Arpin
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 953
From: Sunland, CA, USA
Registered: Dec 2006

posted May 14, 2008 10:29 PM

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Tom-Just wondering if you sent the lens stand, also. I've seen that listed before and has gone for around $50-$60. By the way, my name is not Racies its Arpin.

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Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 14, 2008 11:12 PM

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IMPORTANT UPDATE:

I just received a very kind and thoughtful e-mail from Dave Thomas of Dave Thomas Films. I owe Dave a major apology. He is a perfect example of someone with a very kind and forgiving heart. He said that the BUHL lenses came from ICECO International Cinema Equipment Company. He said the stand's and brackets came from Derann. Anyway I evidentally did not purchase this lens from one of Dave's fliers and did chose the BUHL. Dave said it's a fixed focus lens compared to the KOWA. The KOWA is a bit easier to set up. Anyway I told Dave that Steve has the len's and now the instructions too. Dave said it should work when using the instructions. Well anyway it was good to hear from Dave! I think I will eventually hear from Steve Osborne in regard's to this lens and kit. Anyway MANY THANK'S to Dave for the GREAT e-mail. Dave is super8movieman on e-bay. Give Dave some business!!!

To Osi:

Sorry to hear you got taken a few times in the hobby from overseas sellers. Ray Courts was telling me one time on the phone when he was a film broker about overseas collectors and certain dealers here in the United States. He said in many cases overseas people only would trust Ray with 16mm transactions. Because people were taken from overseas so much by certain 16mm dealers here.

To Larry:

I must know a Larry Racies from another film forum. Yes, I sent the entire kit to Steve. Now I will see what Steve say's when he contacts me again. It would be good to get Steve together with Dave to learn how to use this scope lens. I think the thing that threw everyone off was the fixed focus aspect of this lens. You must loosen the set screw's in the lens for it to be able to work. I think John Whittle mentioned this on here as well.

Anyway thank's to Dave for his kind e-mail. I feel a bit better now!

--Tom

SECOND UPDATE:

Steve Osborne just e-mailed me and is sending the 16mm Irwin Allen TV movie out to me soon!!! It look's like this is ALL solved now. It just took some patience!!!

[ May 15, 2008, 08:17 PM: Message edited by: Tom A. Pennock ]

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Tony Stucchio
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 625
From: New Jersey
Registered: Dec 2005

posted May 16, 2008 08:32 PM

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quote:
Hey Tony:

Bad analogy!

Sorry, Tom. I shouldn't have been so insensitive.
But 11 years is a long time to check out something before you contact the seller.

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Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 16, 2008 11:23 PM

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Hi Tony:

I agree with you 100%. Too long! Apologies are in order for BOTH Dave Thomas and Steve Osborne. I did give the len's to Steve and talked with Dave. Dave is so kind he even thanked me for my e-mail. Now that is super nice. I have been stressed lately with major family problems. Not to the extent that Jan has gone through but quite stressful. I think this is what caused me some problems. I am glad that Dave and Steve understood. There are some great people in this hobby!!!

Sincerely,

--Tom

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Jan Bister
Darth 8mm

Posts: 2629
From: Ohio, USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted May 17, 2008 02:02 AM

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Tom, since you mention me, I just wanna say I agree! [Smile]

[Smile]

--------------------
Call me Phoenix. *dusts off the ashes*

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Michael O'Regan
Film God

Posts: 3085
From: Essex, UK
Registered: Oct 2007

posted May 17, 2008 02:16 AM

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Hi Tom,
I'm happy to hear this all ended up ok for you.

-Mike

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David Kilderry
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 963
From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
Registered: Feb 2006

posted May 17, 2008 04:12 AM

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Tom I am glad too as I have found both Dave and Steve excellent over many years.

Osi, what was the name of the company or guy in Australia that you did the bad deal with? I know of or have heard of most of the collectors here.

I was ripped off once from someone that I did a good deal with previously, he skipped town and I even found he owed rent and others money too. A shifty character called Kelvin.

David

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted May 17, 2008 04:10 PM

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Sorry, I don't remember the names of either of these men, but if I did, I'd probably due my own manhunt to find them and, let us say, bring back to remembrance in my own "talented" way, that they owe me big-time.

One of my short lived careers in the past (before becoming a believer) that I'd rather forget. I'm not proud of all my past deeds.

--------------------
"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Mark Todd
Film God

Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003

posted May 17, 2008 04:30 PM

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Hi Tom, look at it in a possitive light if you can afford to buy something for $300 ten odd years ago and not use it your quite lucky in the round of it, no joke my entire collection just clears that at the moment ( 3 young kids) and been collecting for 20 years.

It was bad luck but try not to keep beating yourself up about it, you have some amazing films etc it was ages ago and film has given you lots of pleasure. Try to let it go, I`m sure there was no ill intent from anyone and just enjoy this great little hobby.
Hec if I had 20% of your collection I`d be singing and dancing for the next 3 months.
Best wishes Mark.

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Tom A. Pennock
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Battle Creek, MI. USA
Registered: Apr 2004

posted May 19, 2008 04:09 PM

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Thank you Mark for the kind good wishes!
Sincerely Your Friend,
--Tom

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted May 19, 2008 06:02 PM

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One thing is for sure, sometimes you must be the "squeaky wheel" if your going to get the grease, even if the grease may be a little long in the coming.

--------------------
"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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Jan Bister
Darth 8mm

Posts: 2629
From: Ohio, USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted May 20, 2008 05:18 AM

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I agree with Osi... in fact, what doesn't crack the cog only makes it stronger - or something like that [Big Grin]

[Big Grin]

--------------------
Call me Phoenix. *dusts off the ashes*

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