8mm Forum: John Yapp's telecine

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Topic: John Yapp's telecine

John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008

posted April 05, 2013 11:06 AM

Hello John,
I have created this as a separate topic because like Janice I'm keen to find out more about NO_DUPS , can you point me in the right direction for this (plugin/filter?)
John

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 07, 2013 04:46 PM

Hi John,
No_Dups is a Avisynth script for removing duplicate frames before using Videofred's film restoring script. It makes Fred's script work MUCH better.

The actual script is very simple.

LoadPlugin("DGbob.dll")
LoadPlugin("FDecimate.dll")

DirectShowSource("your filname here.avi")
ConvertToYUY2()

# Convert to fields and shifting every other field by half a line:
DGBob(order=0,thresh=12)

# Remove duplicate frames:
# In the last line, you need to fine tune the resulting frame rate (currently 16.0). Fractional numbers are allowed.
# In the ideal case, you should see no duplicate frames and no skipped frames.
FDecimate(rate=16.6667, threshold=3)

just copy and paste this text into notepad, and save as No_Dups.avs. Remember to save as "other files" rather than as text, or the script won't work.

As you can see, the script calls on two filters, DGbob.dll"
and "FDecimate.dll". You should find these available to download easily enough. If not, PM me.

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John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008

posted April 07, 2013 05:08 PM

Thank you John,
I'll give these a go and let you know how I get on. Does the avi need to be progressive?

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 07, 2013 05:18 PM

The file needs to be progressive to work in Fred's restoring script, but No_Dups will make it progressive anyway.

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 07, 2013 05:52 PM

Thank you John. It does improve Fred's scripts with real-time captures since his scripts are made for frame-by-frame. Most of the artifacts occur when the camera is panning or there's fast motion. The NO_DUPS script seems to minimize some of the double images. I wish I had had this script when I was converting my 16mm films. It would have saved me hours in manually deleting double frames. I might go back and redo some now [Smile]

Have you tried adjusting the threshold to see the effect?

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 07, 2013 05:55 PM

I can't say that i have Janice. I'd be interested to know your findings if you try though.

For anyone intersted, or who wonders what the hell we're going on about, here is a longer telecine clip using post processing with avisynth and virtualdub. The film is from the seventies i believe, and due to bright sunlight, there are some exposure problems but parts of it show how good the use of these programmes can be when transferring films from yesteryear.
http://youtu.be/9WdD39IB_tg

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 07, 2013 10:14 PM

Here's a side-by-side before and after restoration sample I did from 65 year old 16mm film.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqQfz4ccvy8&list=UUzhVuBJou11ziWdERi0ZGuQ&index=16

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 07, 2013 10:37 PM

like everything else you do Janice, a very accomplished job.

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 09, 2013 03:29 AM

John...I did a test lowering the threshold to 1 and got fewer dup frames...but it didn't eliminate all which were visable after running Fred's script. So I followed up by running the resulting file from Fred's script thru the NO_DUPS script again (threshold 1) and it cleaned up those extra frames great.

Thank you John...I'm now going to redo my 16mm telecines using the script [Smile]

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008

posted April 09, 2013 08:31 AM

Hi John,
just a quick bit of feedback - here is my first result using your script https://vimeo.com/63615500 it's not absolutely perfect but it's a big improvement on both my results before and the time they took.
Janice is really a lateral thinker - it would never have occurred to me to run the script twice (my attempt above is a single run).
Of course the junction between shots tends to go awry but that's what editing is for.
Thanks to yourself, Janice (and unofficially Martin, I'm guessing),
John

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 09, 2013 09:10 AM

Hi John
Firstly, let me say that I think your results are superb.
Secondly, As much as I'd like to claim the credit, No_Dups has nothing at all to do with me (or Martin Jones, for that matter.)It is a simple script that I found online some time ago as part of a thread about spot removal form 16mm film, but was uncredited.
I would be grateful if you could remove any reference to it being mine, or Martin's from the vimeo clip you have linked to.
Once again, Nice job!

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Martin Jones
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1269
From: Thetford , Norfolk,England
Registered: May 2008

posted April 09, 2013 10:19 AM

Not a Software expert,John... in fact a complete nerd if the program is not a neatly packaged commercial one! My expertise lies in Optics, Mechanics and Electronics at the "hands-on" level. I don't know the difference between bytes and bits, or even 1s or 0s (unless they are the mathematical kind).
Martin

--------------------
Retired TV Service Engineer
Ongoing interest in Telecine....

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John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008

posted April 09, 2013 10:45 AM

Hi John and Martin,
no problem I'll remove the references, I always try to give credit where I can (sometimes too enthusiastically in this case)

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Janice Glesser
Film Goddess

Posts: 3468
From: Sunnyvale, CA USA
Registered: Sep 2011

posted April 09, 2013 03:28 PM

Can I ask you guys...John Yapp and John Davis...which of Fred's scripts do you use or prefer? ... The frame interpolation or the blending? Do you find after running NO_DUPS that panning shots appear a bit choppy?

--------------------
Janice

"I'm having a very good day!"
Richard Dreyfuss - Let It Ride (1989).

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John Yapp
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Telford England.
Registered: Dec 2011

posted April 09, 2013 05:28 PM

hi Janice.
I personally use Fred's blending script as it seems to produce fewer unwanted artifacts, although i think the script with interpolation is capable of better results from the right subject. In the past i have used both and picked the best results from each to edit together.
I think the reality is that when using these scripts for the first time, one is blown away by the improvement, then as you become familiar with them, it's back to looking for all the imperfections that frankly, people we show our results to probably never see, but we know they're there.

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John Davis
Master Film Handler

Posts: 286
From: Dunfermline, Fife, UK
Registered: Jun 2008

posted April 09, 2013 06:35 PM

I've tended to use the interpolation version (I thought the blending version was only intended for fast moving subjects - though I'm struggling to work out where I read that)

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Osi Osgood
Film God

Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005

posted April 09, 2013 06:53 PM

Janice, your quite the artist! That's a GREAT restoration!

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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "

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