8mm Forum: GS1200 : Synchro / Regulation question

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Topic: GS1200 : Synchro / Regulation question

Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015

posted November 07, 2016 09:47 AM

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Goodmorning GS1200 Fans & Users,

These are questions for users who are making sound transfer from DVD etc.....

- By differents versions and "vintages" (MK1, MK2, MK3, etc.....) is there big improvements concerning regulations and synchronization capabilities, (performances, accuracy, etc.........)between each of them ?

- How much is the maximum shift observed between an exellent "25 fps source" (Crystal frequencies) and the driven projector ? (For exemple: 1sec for 35mn or 2sec for 35 mn, etc.........)

Thanks in advance

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Alexander Vandeputte
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 243
From: Belgium
Registered: Nov 2009

posted November 07, 2016 12:43 PM

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I have used the sync capability on all three versions of the GS1200. I my experience I have never observed sync drift...
I feed the machine a 25Hz signal through the ESS socket. Once I get the sound from the DVD aligned with the picture, it keeps sync until the end of the ride.
Others may have different experiences and/or may have more in depth technical knowledge regarding eventual differences between the Elmo versions.

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 01:45 PM

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From reading all that I have Phil on the forums and from talking with various GS 1200 owners over the years, there should be no noticeable drift even after an hour or more of running film if your frames on the film are an identical match to those from your digital source.

These devices keep superb accuracy from an accurate and precise pulse.

People at conventions have ran full features from beginning to end with a THX Dolby track from digital technology running in parallel with it.

Obviously all splices need to made frame perfect and not one single frame can be different or missing for any reason.

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted November 07, 2016 02:15 PM

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Phil,

I am constantly re-recording films on my GS-1200 using a sync box and I have never encountered any drift.

Doug

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I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015

posted November 07, 2016 02:29 PM

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Hi Doug, Alexander

Could you tell me more about Synchro Boxes?

Do you use same synchro Box (Is ther any schemas somewhere)?

Are you extracting Synchro pulses (25fps) from DVD on Computer?

Andrew, in my case , I just need accuracy for 180Meters maximum

In fact, I am just specifying that the more important is the drift is so limited that it is not possible to be noticed....

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 02:41 PM

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Remember that some of the version 1 machines will only pulse sync at 18 fps not 25 fps, Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015

posted November 07, 2016 02:47 PM

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Hi Mark,

That's right, also I have quicly observed that last machines are fitted with LED sensors instead of ILS for former machines.

I assume Electronic is rather different between each version, to be confirm

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 02:54 PM

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Hi Phil,
I'm not sure on the electrical differences but they are certainly different on my version 1 machine and my very late version 3, i know that an early machine can be modified with a later speed board to sync at 25fps with not too much difficulty, i had it done years ago.Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Douglas Meltzer
Moderator

Posts: 4554
From: New York, NY, USA
Registered: Jun 2003

posted November 07, 2016 02:58 PM

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Phil,

There was a talented gentleman named Wolfgang who made these sync boxes (under the name Pedro), however he has been out of contact for quite a while. His website where they were sold is no longer online.

The box is a direct digital synthesizer and connects to the ESS input on the GS. The last model he released was able to work with NTSC systems. Although the frame rate can be changed manually, there are 5 presets for 16, 18, 24, 25 & 23.976024 fps.

He had posted that there were a number of models:

1. P1008GS-Q (crystal control only for Elmo GS1200MO):

2. P1008GS-U (automatic crystal control & external sync unit for Elmo GS1200MO):

3. R1008MD (unit for recording sync sound while shooting film, to any stereo audio recorder with mic input):

4. P1008Q (universal synchronizer unit, direclty working with Braun Visacustic projectors and Bauer studio class projectors T502 and above, adaptable to virtually all devices with regualted DC motor):

5. B1008S (adaption kit for Bauer studio class projectors to run with P1008Q)

You might also find this thread about syncing a GS with a PC useful.

Doug

--------------------
I think there's room for just one more film.....

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 03:53 PM

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And if anyone just so happens to have one of those P1008Q controllers and B1008S circuit boards c/w wiring diagram stashed away somewhere in a dark cupboard, I am all ears if you'd ever like to part with it.

Must still be all in full working order of course. [Big Grin]

[Big Grin]

[Wink]

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 04:00 PM

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Andrew,
Got mine from FFR filmtek in Germany, I think they still sell them and much cheaper (65 euros)than the Pedro box, Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Phil Murat
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 671
From: Villeneuve St Georges, France
Registered: Dec 2015

posted November 07, 2016 04:01 PM

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Thanks Doug,

Now , I have "material" for "long" Winter Evenings !!!

I let you know

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 04:02 PM

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Thanks Mark, I haven't noticed the controller but I will look and ask again. [Smile]

[Smile]

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 04:04 PM

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They still sell them, I've bought two off them and they work perfectly, Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 04:34 PM

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Do they sell the motor controller circuit boards seperately Mark or do you buy it all as a kit?

How much are they Mark?

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 04:49 PM

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It's the small grey box with a lead for the pulse sync 65 euros, it's in the elmo accessories section, Mark.

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Jason Smith
Master Film Handler

Posts: 358
From: Tohoku, Japan
Registered: Oct 2015

posted November 07, 2016 05:04 PM

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Mark,

Is this the syncbox that you got from them? I"ve had my eye on getting one of these for awhile.

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 05:14 PM

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Yes Jason that's the one, thanks for putting up a picture, Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 05:19 PM

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Ah sorry Mark, I thought you were referring to one specifically designed for the Bauer T610 / 525 etc like the ones I requested above.

These were made by Pedro originally but I haven't seen anyone who has copied these in recent times or even attempted to make a viable alternative controller and circuit board sadly.

I fear this one here is only of any use on an Elmo GS 1200.

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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Mark Mander
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1236
From: Dunstable ,Bedfordshire.
Registered: Jan 2005

posted November 07, 2016 05:56 PM

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Sorry to build your hopes up Andrew, I thought you wanted one for the GS, Mark

--------------------
Elmo GS1200 1.0 lens
Elmo ST1200HD 1.1 lens
Sankyo 800 1.0 lens
Elmo 16CL
Elf NT1

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Andrew Woodcock
Film God

Posts: 7477
From: Manchester Uk
Registered: Aug 2012

posted November 07, 2016 06:04 PM

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Ohhh no Mark! 🔨😂😂😂

--------------------
"C'mon Baggy..Get with the beat"

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