Advice On Gate Chatter and Unsteady Picture Eiki Slim Line 16mm Projector

[Ken Souza]

I have an EIKI Slim Line projector (Brown Case) which I have had for many years, it’s been a wonderful work horse projector. Just recently when running film, it has become loud when film runs through the gate and chatters. Which is causing an unsteady picture.

I have lubed my projectors, but I have never dealt with this. So I am seeing if anyone else has has this problem and can give me any suggestions on what I can do to fix the problem. Do I need to adjust something with the claws or gate, or take it into my repair guy?

I don’t want to run film on it until I can get this sorted out. ☹

Thanks in advance for any help or advice.
Ken

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

That sound like either a dried up films, or overly moisted films to me.
Does that happen to only to a particular reel, or any reels you run on?

[Jim Schrader]

Could be the upper loop is not forming the upper loop has a built in device that forms it then drops down or maybe the springs in the e gate are losing strength to keep the film against the gate? Could be other things since I have 2 of these I’m sure it’ll happen to mine someday.

[Ken Souza]

Thank you Jim and Nantawat for your replies.

I ran some film last night and it seemed a bit better. I clean/lube my prints and I know some old IB The prints get dry and sometimes cranky as they run. I take good care of my prints so I don't think it's mainly the prints. I have a couple of brand new prints that have been losing their loop and garbled sound. But not all the time

I think it might be the upper loop like Jim suggests and the gate getting a little lose. I have the service e manual. I am going to see if I can figure it out over the weekend. This is my favorite projected and it's never given me trouble. Maybe it needs a vacation at a film exchange LOL

I will report back if I figure it out

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Try treading the film as usual, but with projector unplugged, then manually move the mechanic by hand using the inching knob on the front to the point when the claws retracted from the film. Then try moving the film up/down a bit - there should be just enough tension from the front pressure plate to hold the film in place. If this feels "off" (excessively loose, or unusually tight) then the gate assembly is somewhat off the alignment. The next suspect would be the cam/claw assembly, which hopefully wouldn't be the case as it would be more involving to resolve.

[Simon Wyss]

Do see after the lateral film guide. The canal should be clean as a whistle and some pressure on the film edge exerted by a spring-loaded rail.

[Ed Slosky]

Ken - did you, or anyone, ever get a solution for this gate chatter? I was running some 16 mm home movie films tonight and suddenly the gate started to chatter on my Kodascope Pageant. Funny thing is it’s the newer films doing it. The ones from the 1930s and 1940s went fine. But once I did the 1950s, the chattering started. I also noticed the old reels are steel…the newer ones seem to be more aluminum like. Not sure if that means anything or not. I’m thinking of putting the 1950s films on the 1940 reels to see if that does anything or not. Additionally, the holes do not seem to be getting damaged by the chattering. In the meantime, any potential solutions that actually worked would be helpful.

[Ken Souza]

Hi Ed,

Yes I got resolved chatter problem. After chatting with Richard Burgess the projector god, he advised me to check the gate and there are a couple ion little screws and possibly my gate was out of alignment. I did what Richard suggested and did a little tweaking to my gate and I have no problems now. Not sure if your projector has the same type of gate. I have 2 Eiki's I adjusted the gates and all good now. Please newer prints need a little lube/cleabing too.

If you can't get your problem solved I would suggest you speak to Richard, he is great! If you need his information, please PM me.

Hope this helps.
Ken

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Don't know if this would solve your issue, but hope this might be eventually useful...

Despite my best attempt to adjust/align the gate assembly in my Eiki SL-2 as good as it could be (film gate & pressure gate perfectly lined up / claw tip hit at dead center of peforations / etc.) but there's something still missing. Most reels would project just fine but it still doesn't like certain reels - the image still jitters somewhat. Out of desperation I just, for the heck of it, lightly press my finger tip on the pressure plate and voilà...the jitter is gone.

So it's basically just the worn spring that lost its grip, after these 40 years or so. I need to slightly increase the spring tension just enough to overcome the jitter.



But rather than just stretching it out to restore its grip (and maybe stretch it out too far, causing irreversible damage to it😱) I decided to add the cardboard shim under it instead. After playing around with various shim thickness i eventually got the "right ones".



Now the image is dead steady - almost like a slide projector! All reels are now equally steady too. Therefore case closed, happy ending.

[Ed Slosky]

Ken and Nantawat - thanks for all the info. I didn’t message you yet Ken for the other fellows info…I need to give some more info. Nantawat’s earlier post about degraded film really got me thinking about things.

The reels I’m dealing with are home films and no care was given all that time. After my grandmother passed in 2022, I found them in the garage. Before that they were probably in a shed or attic. I also noticed the reels from the 1930s and 1940s are Agfa while the 1950s are Kodak. Not saying one company is better than another - I have no experience with that…just stating the facts. None of them really smell like vinegar (much) and they were all in cardboard unlike some others in the tins which are really vinegary (I have not attempted to play those yet).

Anyway, I ran a small test and as an earlier post noted I held my finger on the gate on the problem reel. Well that caused some damage. Also of note, the two reels that jump the gate are of poorer quality than the others. They are either really faded in the beginning or are dark and reddish (likely VS but without the strong odor since they were not sealed in tin?).

So now, I’m not really sure if I have a gate issue or a film issue. It may be these newer reels, although newer, are of a different maker and have shrunken? I’m interested to hear your thoughts on this now that I’m giving more info. Thanks in advance!

[Nantawat Kittiwarakul]

Hmmm. If that print managed to self-destruct with just slight increase of the gate tension, I now highly suspect the print itself. Does that look dried up & brittle?

[Ed Slosky]

Hmmm. If that print managed to self-destruct with just slight increase of the gate tension, I now highly suspect the print itself. Does that look dried up & brittle?

That’s the odd thing. Those films don’t really seem that bad as far as dryness and brittleness. However, I did note some twists or bends along the film as I unspooled it. This was not really visible when it was spooled. The more we’re talking it through the more I feel like it’s a film issue and not a gate issue. Perhaps those little bends were just enough to send it off the rails, even thought it looked tightly wound. It made it about 1/3 of the way through before it jumped out of the gate.

[Jim Schrader]

Hi Ken is Richard Burgess on this forum?