Mark S 709

[Jim Patton]

Hello all,

I'm looking for some advice and a direction to start moving in. I'm mechanically inclined and have no issue tearing the machines down if need be.

With my mothers passing in March, my sister and I have finally started going through her things and what's at the house. My father passed 16 years ago but I wasn't aware that she kept my father's Eumig, or at least never got rid of it and it was stored in an attic knee wall. She never had much interest in it growing up and even my dad moved on once VHS became ubiquitous. I managed to find the manual and the warranty info/registration card this past weekend.

After going through the forum and giving the machine a once over I noticed the claw pin was missing, it intermittently ran in forward, barely in reverse but it would project with a new bulb. I managed to track down another Mark S 709 where the claw pin was still visible in the posted pictures, after some photo manipulation, although it was missing just about everything else; the control knob, both film gates/pressure plates, power cord, etc. I'm hoping to get at least one projector running properly.

The other projector arrived today and although it consistently runs in forward and reverse with no load, on 4" reels it produces the linked projection. Is the claw pin not engaging properly to stabilize the frame or is the the film just not moving fast enough? It conks out on any larger reels. There's also no sound as of yet, but one issue at a time I suppose.

If anyone could point out a good place to start? I have also inherited a pile of movies I'd love to go through, although some clearly need repair. I'm especially excited about the Buster Keaton films, a Hitchcock, and the various short reels of my father in the navy overseas and his travels around the US.

Jim

[Joseph Banfield]

From looking at your video it's pretty obvious you have a broken claw pin. The slowing down is probably because the rubber drive discs inside the machine need a good cleaning. The 709 uses a vacuum tube amplifier and I wouldn't go poking around in there unless you know what you're doing because of the high voltages.

But there's no point in addressing any other issue until the claw, if there is one, is pulling down the film smoothly!

[Jim Patton]

How long is the pin normally? I’ve linked a video of the claw arm and what pin there is being manually actuated.

https://youtube.com/shorts/JHHhkUpxWU0?feature=share

[Paul Adsett]

Claw pin looks fine to me Check the top sprocket and make sure it is firmly locked to its drive shaft

[Joseph Banfield]

Yea, the claw pin looks good to me too. I know this sounds silly but do you have both the front and rear gates for that machine? I assume you removed them for the video so that we could see the claw? In your video I don't hear the typical pulldown noise that the projector should be making, which is why I asked if both the rear and front gates are installed.

[Jim Patton]

Both gates were installed while running film through the projector, and I remember the sound you mentioned which is indeed missing now; a definite high rate “clacking”.

Tonight I’ll put the film guides back in, remove the lens, load in some film, manually advance the film and try to see how the pin’s actually interacting with the film. It might be out of alignment?

[Maurice Leakey]

Jim
The Eumig S709 is a dual gauge projector.
Are you sure you have installed the correct gates to go with the film you have?
Don't forget to place the rear inching knob with its dot set at 12 0'clock. This withdraws the claw. Otherwise, it's single claw will be broken off.
Eumig Mark S 709 – Spare Part Finder – Van Eck Video Services (van-eck.net)

[Jim Patton]

I made sure the correct sprockets were used, by actually checking them against the test film, along with the matching color film gates although I’ll double check again tonight.

[Joseph Banfield]

If you have a small piece or scrap film about three inches long you could test the pulldown to make sure the claw is entering the sprocket holes. You could do this by just inserting the rear gate piece and holding that and the film in place with a couple of fingers keeping pressure on both while turning the inching knob while looking down the lens opening (lens removed). You won't be able to see claw penetration with both of the gate pieces in place. You need to see the claw penetrate the sprocket hole by just a bit and directly in the center of sprocket hole too.

[Jim Patton]

It’s centered fairly well but isn’t crossing the plane of the film.

[Jim Patton]

Ok. So… looking over the mechanism.. I need to shift the shutter over just enough to move the claw arm assembly, so the pin just barely engages the film?

[Joseph Banfield]

Yes, the claw pin is perfectly centered as it should be but there doesn't seem to be any penetration to do the pulldown. Perhaps the pulldown arm has been bent a bit? Or perhaps someone has messed with the two set screws on the three bladed shutter? If so, carefully loosen the screws on the shutter and give it a slight push toward the lens and retighten the screws, this will increase penetration of the claw. But don't let the shutter rotate as you do this and check the penetration again using your test film as before. You may have to repeat that adjustment several times until you get it just right. If you finally get penetration of the claw and the pulldown is now working correctly check to be sure that one of the blades is blocking the light path at the instant the claw moves down or you will get ghosting in your image, which is why I say not to rotate the shutter when the screws are loose...just push or pull it as needed and it just needs a bit to make a big difference.

[Jim Patton]

Before I go any further. I’m assuming that the two set screws on the grub screw are for the shaft the shutter is on, as indicated in the attached image? The wax, or whatever they used, on the set screws hadn’t been disturbed.

I’m definitely going to need a better screwdriver

[Jim Patton]

Also trying to figure where this piece came from. It’s about 4mm wide and I noticed it after I had taken the sound panel out.

[Joseph Banfield]

No, the two set screws you have circled are not the right ones. The ones you need are on the three bladed shutter (the thing that spins behind the claw arm that interupts the light).

I have no idea what that small piece is for that you found inside the machine.