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Author
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Topic: Choosing a Video Projector
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Paul Adsett
Film God
Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted November 04, 2009 12:58 PM
Hi Steve,
Glad to hear you are about to purchase a video projector - I assure you that you are in for a treat no matter what projector you decide on. After years (or in my case decades!)of having to go through the 'torture' of deciding on what super 8mm films to buy within your budget, video projection with DVD'S is like being a kid in a candy store - so much to choose from at so little price! You will be watching all the hundreds of great movies that have never made it to super 8mm. All of which is not to denigrate super 8mm in any way. Once a 'reel' man always a 'reel' man!
Now as to the choice of a good projector, this depends a lot on your budget. Like everything else in life you get what you pay for and the higher price VP'S usually have better performance (brighter, better contrast). But the nice thing is this - even the budget priced projectors will blow you away in terms of picture quality. Expect bright, really sharp PQ, with great looking color, no matter what PJ you get.
Personally, I like the Panasonic range, for several reasons:
1. They all have 2X zoom lenses, which means you can put the PJ at the back of the room alongside your super 8mm projector. So its out of sight and out of the way. I do not like seeing a PJ hung from the ceiling right over the audience.
2. The Panasonics have large 'lens shift' range. This means that theprojector lens can be moved up and down and sideways (without moving the projector) to accurateley center the picture on the screen. Projectors which do not have lens shift capability are a real pain to align with the screen.
3. Finally, and I think the most important, at least for me, is that Panasonic are the only projectors which have their patented Smooth Screen Technology which TOTALLY eliminates pixel visibility and the dreaded screen door effect. This means that your picture will look almost as good as film, with none of the pixel blocks being visible no matter how close you sit to the screen.
Another decision you have to make is whether to buy and LCD or DLP projector. DLP'S used to have much better contrast than LCD, and LCD used to have much better color saturation than DLP, but this is no longer the case with the two technologies now being very close in terms of PQ. The main disadvantage of DLP is the dreaded 'rainbow effect' caused by the mechanically spinning color wheel inside single chip DLP projectors. It can cause you to see color fringing on fast moving objects, and can also cause headaches and nausea. The vast majority of people do not see it, but if your one of the 5% of the population that do, it can be a real problem.
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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj
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Paul Adsett
Film God
Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted November 05, 2009 10:09 AM
Steve,
If a member of your family suffers from seizure disorder then you absolutely must stay clear of a DLP projector. I am not hear to bash DLP, but the fact is that a single chip DLP projector uses a spinning color wheel to produce the color (something like the early 1900's Kinemacolor system which had a spinning red and green filter in front of the projector) and this can really upset some people. Even if it does not induce a seizure it can induce headaches and nausea in a small percentage of the population. Personally, I would not want to take the chance that someone in my audience was experiencing discomfort, even if I was not. Now, all that I have said does not apply to 3-chip DLP projectors, but these are extremely expensive , $15k and up. LCD projectors use 3 separate red, blue, and green panels, and have no such prolem. The main advantage of DLP over LCD is that the pixel gaps are a bit smaller, so you get a little less screen door effect. DLP contrast used to be better than LCD, but this is no longer the case.
Both technologies have their own reliability issues. The failure mode for LCD projectors is usually long term heat damage of the polarizers ( my Panny is now 5 years old and is still running great, so lifetime clearly depends on how many hours a day you run the projector) The failure mode for single chip DLP projectors seems to be mainly the failure of the color wheel bearings, which are running at about 20,000 rpm, and the resultant shattering of the color wheel.
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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj
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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted November 05, 2009 12:11 PM
Steve, looking at the Epson and Panasonic, I know this is probably a LOT more than you were planning to spend, but I cannot praise my JVC DLA-HD350 enough. Granted £3500 is a whole lot of serious money, but I have bought several projectors from various well known brands over the years and many have proved a disappointment, making me wish I'd saved my money for something better. About a year ago I paid nearly £2000 for a DLP which turned into a nightmare...broke 3 times in a few months ![[Frown]](frown.gif) . It is now a £2000 doorstop! I kid you not...
Honestly, unless you start moving into £10,000 upwards, the JVC's are, in my opinion, really the best out there. They just don't have competition, except, as pointed out in another thread they are only 1000 lumens which can be an issue if your screen is really big! But performance is the most filmic I have seen from a sub-£10,000 projector. At least arrange a demo ![[Wink]](wink.gif) !
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Christopher P Quinn
Expert Film Handler
Posts: 210
From: Bedfordshire
Registered: Sep 2008
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posted November 06, 2009 10:27 AM
Paul, have you had 5 years trouble free, I seem to remember you had to have a repair done at some stage. Mine is now working again, but for how long I don’t know as still running tests.
It is pretty obvious that the more you spend the better you get, that’s life. These projectors are not perfect, the polarising filters don’t stay absolutely lined up and therefore colour problems can and do appear. Any LCD at the budget end of the market will not be able to produce a 100% clear white light from corner to corner. And if they do at the start, they won’t after 100-200 hours.
I started my association with VP trying to get a real film like look. That was a frustrating and wasteful time, tweaking and tweaking the things until I ran of tweaks. You won’t get it. But you do get a great picture from DVD and far more so from blu-ray, and if you learn to love both differently you will enjoy your VP no matter what one you choose. I recommend the Panasonic and also the Epson. The Epson is cheaper than the Panny and if you don’t have a blu-ray player the Epson would allow you to buy a blu-ray player within or near enough the budget for getting the Panny. Knowing what I know now I would be happy with the Epson, but £1800 would get me a good DLP and I would chance the rainbow, as I here that this effect even on the cheaper ones are a lot better now. Although if like Paul your planning large audiences then maybe not.
Isn’t it funny the way there is now a gathering passion growing for VP. A few years ago and this would have been ignored.
Chris.
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Chris Quinn Rides again.
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Paul Adsett
Film God
Posts: 5003
From: USA
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted November 06, 2009 11:27 AM
Hi Chris,
You have a good memory! Yes, you are absolutely right, a couple of years ago I did have to send my Panny AE700 off for repair to the Panasonic Service Center in Lexington Kentucky. All of a sudden the projector would not power up, I thought it was the lamp, but it turned out to be the power supply. Panasonic installed a new power supply upgrade at no cost (I was still a couple of months inside the 2 year extended warranty that I had purchased) and the VP has operated flawlessly ever since. It still has the original lamp, which is now getting close to 3000 hours, so I will be replacing that pretty soon. The only issue I have is that the picture is dimmer than it was, due no doubt to the ageing lamp. But color, contrast, and sharpness look as good as when new so, at this time, I have no problem at all with the polarizers.
Bottom line for me Chris, is that I feel the Panny has served me very well for 5 years now, which is a good lifetime for a VP. Next year, I am hoping to get the new 1080p Panny AE4000, which I gather is a huge jump in PQ from my little AE700.
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The best of all worlds- 8mm, super 8mm, 9.5mm, and HD Digital Projection,
Elmo GS1200 f1.0 2-blade
Eumig S938 Stereo f1.0 Ektar
Panasonic PT-AE4000U digital pj
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Rob Young.
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1633
From: Cheshire, U.K.
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted November 06, 2009 12:57 PM
Steve, you're right that a lot of VP's are sold as commercial boxes for conferences and the like, but there is a whole market out there for home cinema. It's actually the new "trendy" thing, here in the UK at least ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif) ! Of course, most premier league footballers weren't alive when super 8 was about, so they think spending a fortune on a home cinema is a "new" thing!!!
You need to go to specialist dealers. High street electrical retailers aren't interested in this market. Don't know about the states, but here there are lots of really knowledgeable shops if you know where to look. And that doesn't necessarily mean expensive..."Sevenoaks" for example, or "Practical hi-fi".
Try searching the web for these UK shops and then finding the equivalent where you are. Also look at the web site for UK publication "Home Cinema Choice".
Many moons ago I worked for a "specialist" hi-fi shop and learned then that really good, solid advice is only based upon actually using gear...and that really good retailers actually do care that their customers are buying kit that they are going to be happy with. Also, when things do go wrong, it is essential to have a relationship with a good dealer...something you don't get by buying cheap off the web; good for some things, but not things like a VP.
Over the last year alone, I have learned yet again that being able to return to a good, solid dealer with whom you have a relationship is the only answer when you end up at loggerheads with the manufacturer.
Christopher; DLP and "rainbow"...hasn't improved at all. In some cases it is actually worse. The thing to look for in the spec. is the SPEED of the colour wheel...and this isn't always made obvious. Colour wheels are often quoted as having 5, 6, 7 segments. This only affects colour rendition and is often mis-quoted as diminishing "rainbow". Colour wheel speed determines rainbow. Many expensive single chip machines use 4x speed which, if you're like me and see rainbow is TOTALLY unnacceptable. Some use 6x...certainly rainbow is dimished but then you get into other problems....
PS. Peter, I just re-read your post about "Sound and Vision" and to avoid any potential mis-understanding, would like to clarify that I certainly DO NOT see them as being a "cheap off the web" company. I have a lot of respect for them. But I think you all know that there are plenty "cheap off the web" companies out there
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Mark Todd
Film God
Posts: 3846
From: UK
Registered: Aug 2003
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posted November 06, 2009 02:16 PM
Hi Steve might I suggest you ring a few local AV outlets and see whats on the shelves second hand or ex demo etc.
Many office based machines are also superb for DVD etc.
Are you doing Blu Ray or Just DVD.
I find dvd projected to be superb and far good enough for me.
The sony,s epsons, philips and hitachi LCD machines are very good for video projection and some even have 3 colours in so you can do pretty good 1080i with an XGA machine, thats 2.3 million pixels you simply will not see.
I`d suggest trying to pick up an ex office or school Philips B,Sure 4000 series machine, around 1600 lumens but not too bright as video biased and the picture on these is superb.
Its a 4/3 machine but you can watch 16/9 and also zoom in with different ratio,s and colour adjustemenst etc.
I reckon you would pick an OK one up for around $150 and they also have a really decent zoom lens with good range so you can set the machine back.
You might see one cheap on ebay with a back up etc, the best are the long rectangular ones with the lens on the center front, and they are absolutely silent running as well, Marvelous Machines.
Somthing like that would be a good toe dip into the water etc. Decent DVD blows most 16mm well way even on these philips, they are that good.
Best Mark.
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Fair enough, Steve...you should have heard the conversation when I brought home the JVC!!!![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
I menat i cant afford a top of the range. Thanks to all though, i am learning and researching. 
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