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Topic: Film Prices on the up?
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Adrian Winchester
Film God
Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004
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posted February 14, 2012 11:49 AM
I'd sgree that there's evidence of prices rising. I heard of a dealer recently saying that due to the demand for films, he was offering more money to sellers, so that's bound to be reflected in his prices. Whilst I'm all for picking up bargains, the current situation seems much healthier for the hobby than the scenario predicted by one well-known gentleman in the UK, who not very long ago urged collectors selling up to do so quickly, before there was no option other than to put the films in a skip!
I'd agree with Lee that there could be a link to 'Super 8'. It's hard to point to hard facts that indicate this, but maybe it has generally caused a raising of awareness that has influenced the market. If any dealers were to say that 16mm interest has remained static whilst Super 8 has risen, that would certainly imply that 'Super 8' had been a factor.
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Adrian Winchester
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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God
Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted February 14, 2012 05:46 PM
I don't see Barry of Independent 8's price rise up. And if Barry can confirm that there is no significant change on his sell before and after Derann, it means the situation is temporal.
In other words, those new bloods do not know where to buy super 8mm and just rely on Ebay. This of course will pump the price up. But then after being involved in this hobby, they would now Paul Foster, Barry, CHC and others to make a better deal.
We have several new bloods here, and allow me to mention who I can remember. There is Akshay, Anthony, Bruce Wright, Grant Fitzgerald, and many others. When they started they didn't know these dealers and thinking buying $25 for a 400' is a good deal. But through this forum they got a lot of information and now can buy more selective.
So I believe it will get back to normal again after 6-12 months.
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Winbert
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Akshay Nanjangud
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 637
From: Dallas, TX
Registered: Nov 2011
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posted February 14, 2012 06:53 PM
Winbert, rest assured that I haven't purchased a 400' digest for $25. Back in November, when I was just starting out I bought Buster Keaton's College and Sherlock, Jr. for 19.99, few 400' silent shorts of Laurel and Hardy, Chaplin and Keaton for $8. My expensive films include Foreign Correspondent, Invasion of the Body Snatchers and Saturday Night Fever, all purchased from forum members. So, all features I purchased subsequently were close to prices I have seen sell on the forum.
There are reasons why prices sometimes look high on eBay. Both of these have happened to me and will reflect how the prices on eBay needn't be the sale price.
1. There was an item I really wanted on eBay from a particular seller. I negotiated it to include another item from the same seller. So, I bought his first item on the high Buy It Now and he modified the receipt to reflect my purchase. However, if I look at the item it still reflects the Buy It Now price. Perhaps you guys know this already?
2. Once a seller wasn't able to change the Buy It Now price to our negotiated price. So, he just returned the extra I paid via PayPal. But eBay still considers it sold at the But It Now price.
Now, I ask for some advice. My wife and I have been speaking about the future of my hobby. Barring accidents my wife and I should be around a few more decades. Some questions are:
1. Do we sell now or next year for small profits? Or wait like some have waited for their Star Wars and James Bond titles to appreciate?
2. Would it be worth investing in prime titles? People invest in stocks and pray for good returns. Films could be similar, only their appreciation will depend on my maintenance. Would Star Wars bought at $1000 today appreciate a lot in 30 years?
Maybe I am thinking too far ahead.
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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God
Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted February 14, 2012 07:54 PM
Akhsay, just my short advise... when you are dealing with a hobby don't ever think about making profit (investment). You will feel bad eventually.
Hobby is to fill our boring lives and be with that. The value of it is more than any money can pay.
I have three main hobbies, 8mm, LP/vinyls and model train. Wherever I feel bad with my office's situation or family matters, etc I go to one of my hobby. It relieved me and it was more than going to a doctor for a consultation (a stress is paid by another stress when paying their bill ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ).
Sharing hobbies with my sons is something that you cannot imagine. The young ones will ask again and again. A pure collector will be happy if someone asking or put an interest on his/her collection
So that's why several posts ago I said I would never sell my collection (only those multiples).
Last but not least, invest your money for something liquid (property, gold, shares, hard currencies, etc).
cheers,
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Winbert
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Laksmi Breathwaite
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 771
From: Las Vegas
Registered: Nov 2010
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posted February 15, 2012 12:45 AM
Hey Guys! I enjoy because of the hobby and it takes me back to those good old days, before VHS,DVD and Blu-ray. I love Super8 and I guess that is why Spielberg & JJ made the movie. And yes Super8 is getting more popular. And anything that is vintage or old is high in value. Just look at comic collecting, Action figures,models,Magazines,and film posters which is another one of my many hobbies. Superman 1st issue just sold for a million, Batman, and Spiderman as well. Collecting is really booming right now with or without the recession. So someday STAR WARS super 8 feature will go for some out landish price.  
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" Faster then a speeding bullet, more powerful then a Locomotive "."Look up in the sky it's a bird it's a plane it's SUPERMAN"
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted February 15, 2012 12:56 PM
Fun topic, I was just commenting on this on another thread.
Some of the rise in price is due to, "Derann is no longer printing (heck, no longer in business!), and therefore, the price for a Derann, I can make higher."
Now, that's just my theory. However, I think it's not a good move, as there are really only a few prints, even Derann's that will always claim a higher price, the STAR WARS Trilogy, for instance ...
... while the other titles, even though they are Derann's, will rarely if at all, bring in what they were originally purchased for. Sometimes that's not accurate, especially if some of those film, when originally purchased, were around 200 pounds, for instance, but that was way back in the 1980's and such, when 200 pounds had a lot more value than 200 pounds today.
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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted February 19, 2012 11:14 AM
I'm glad this has drummed up some interest, if Ok with all i would like to use some of this, (with no names involved) for the magazine,
I guess at the end of the day it really is a case of Supply and demand, for the wealthy collector money is probably no object for the rare and good features,
I think we are all awaiting the next Perrys list which i think along with the other dealers may well be quite interesting. The major factor here is simply that Derann have gone and in my opinion, there regular monthly lists kept prices stable and reasonabley within reach. I also think we all lived in hope that a new lab would appear and new titles would be announced, My guess is as soon as the labs theys used closed, With Derek gone, this was never going to happen. So, with occassional lists this means films will almost certainly go up.
I also think a lot of people purchasing are only using ebay and probably dont know about the likes of CHC, Paul Foster, Indipendant 8 and Perrys as well as a couple of others, i note a few posts on this very forum with some members asking if there are still places other than e bay they can buy super 8 films, i find this quite astonishing as the search engines will lead them certainly to Foster films & CHC and even the BFCC website which does have many links, anyway, all said and done, super 8mm films have certainly become a collectors hobby with very little new stuff being released, the items that are released are difficult for me to think of the prices, i have paid higher than normal for some films in the past but i now have to really want an item before purchasing. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
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Akshay Nanjangud
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 637
From: Dallas, TX
Registered: Nov 2011
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posted February 19, 2012 01:40 PM
Guys, I feel this discussion would mean more with actual USD values attached to features. Let me set out a list of films and attach to each prices, prices I might consider paying for them, i.e., if I had the money. If others can re-evaluate my prices, offer prices for other titles, it will be interesting.
1. Goldfinger - on some good low fade stock - $350
2. The Terminator - low fade - $400
3. Any Star Wars - stock almost seems unimportant - $700
4. Anything Scorsese - $200-$300
5. Anything Hitchcock - $50 for silent, $80 for B&W sound, $200 for color
6. Laurel & Hardy features - $20 to $45
7. Buster Keaton's features with soundtrack - based on title - $40 to $60
8. Chaplin's talking features - $50 to $100
9. The Wizard of Oz - $250
10. Animated features from Disney - Beauty & the Beast types - $200
11. Master & Commander - supposedly last Derann print - $300
Any comments?
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Lee Mannering
Film God
Posts: 3216
From: The Projection Box
Registered: Nov 2006
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posted February 21, 2012 05:10 AM
Had an interesting discussion with another long time collector recently and we are of the mind a good number are getting a little bored with DVD/ video projection and coming back to film for a more full on involved hobby. The thing is with cine it is more involving as you can search for a film title, a matching nice original box, inspect it on a viewer, clean the film or repair it, project it on just about any size screen at home, collect a few reasonably priced projectors for different gauges, modify them, basic repairs as fairly simple, lamps are cheap and of course we have the nostalgia aspect which is perhaps paramount. To answer Toms original question yes we can pay huge prices if we are desperate enough or daft enough, but there are many nice films around at a sensible cost with the likes of Ind8 offering special offers to collectors as do Classic and Foster Films from time to time which is much appreciated. I personally would and do encourage all to buy for our remaining dealers as they are a lifeline for our movement.
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted February 21, 2012 01:46 PM
... and then there is the successful search, finding that good print you knew was always out there!
I had ran through three or four rotten prints of "Hoppity Goes to Town" (Max FLeischer animated feature), and then, out of nowhere, when I giving up hope, Steve Osbourne got ahold of TWO low fade prints of this, and both for only 70 dollars! I snatched up both immediately, and found them to be two different versions and on two different film stocks!
Derann reprint on LPP, nice!
Red Fox print on Agfa with an extra six minutes with a stunning picture.
... there were a lot of YAHOO's! on that day
... kind of the same thing that will happen when I finally get a great color print of "Grizzly Adams"!
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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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If it becomes the norm i think it may all end sooner rather than later. Ebay tends to be different because there the collector pays what that individuel wants to pay be it low or high but the demise of Derann i think will bring cine film out of reach of average earning people.
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