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Author Topic: Somikon HD-XL Film Scanner & Digitizer (Super) 8mm - EU market
Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted August 17, 2017 07:08 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
TIPS while using the Somikon (or what ever brand)!

1. When using the Frame Adjustment option, to calibrate the scan frame format, it is best to attach your deck - using TV OUT - to an external monitor/TV. I've noticed the build-in LCD screen is not 100% perfect calibrated for the output of the scan area. This will result in a frame offset, that will ruin your scans for the best possible import in your post-production video editing application.

2. For the safety of my scanned mp4's, I copy them after each reel is finished. To secure that my SD card is functioning properly - I use a 4GB one - I reformat the SD after each reel. Another pro is that the mp4's will be renumbered again from 0000.mp4 making the file management much easier.

That's all folks, for now!

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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James Wilson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 230
From: Norwich, UK
Registered: Jan 2015


 - posted August 17, 2017 10:17 AM      Profile for James Wilson   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Berend,
Does this mean everything is working properly now,
& are you happy with the Somikon?
Regards,
James.

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James Wilson

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Peter Scott
Film Handler

Posts: 58
From: Norfolk, UK
Registered: Nov 2014


 - posted August 17, 2017 10:22 AM      Profile for Peter Scott     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Berend

Putting extra weight on the gate has it cured the jumping jack flash syndrome?

Peter

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted August 17, 2017 10:25 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
@James I still have to retrun my deck.

@Peter The extra gentle push force downwards on the spot in my photo does help reducing the JJF syndrome.

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted August 18, 2017 08:31 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Working hard to find the best possible post-processing workflow for the scans I've made so far. Here's a capture of my mother from my parents wedding day on 07/14/1957. Starting all over again in a new workflow.

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(Added plug-in for FCPX: Neat Video v4) highly recommended!

Man-o-man, what a very lucky guy my dad was! [Wink]

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted August 24, 2017 09:02 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
* created a new thread *

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted September 08, 2017 08:05 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
UPDATE! I received my third Somikon HD-XL yesterday. Time for some new testing sequences then this weekend...

Keep you all posted on the 'new' results. [Confused]

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Mike Spice
Master Film Handler

Posts: 421
From: none of your business
Registered: Jun 2017


 - posted September 08, 2017 09:12 AM      Profile for Mike Spice     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
With my wolverine scanner I was advised to unscrew one quarter turn on the silver screws in the underside of the gate to help with Jitter problems.

I have been unable to test this yet, as my scanner is awaiting new parts. (again)

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted September 10, 2017 03:36 PM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks for the heads up Mike, haven't had the time yet to unbox my new deck.

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted December 16, 2017 12:00 PM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Problems with (originally) Double films

Let me, as a newcomer, greet everybody! So far, I’ve been read-only (it’s based on the discussion in this topic that I ordered the Somikon); now that I have some thoughts to share, I decided to register.

I’ve shot over 120 Double-8 and some 6-7 Super 8 films in the eighties (family / travel). The Somikon worked just fine with the Super 8 films (AGFAColor) – it has never had any problems during scanning.

(Orignally) double-8 films, on the other hand, pose some major problems for the scanner. The sole reason for this is the inherently inprecise slitting of the originally 16mm material after development. (Something NOT present with Super-8 cartridges – hence my not having problems with my S8 footage at all in exactly the same scanner.) The scanner would just stick and immediately stop very-very frequently.

I’ve decided to investigate the problem. First, I’ve removed the plastic (and, for the actual scanning process, fully useless) “facade” from the projector as I thought it’s the film, which, in Normal8 mode, shifted backwards, touched by the facade that results in these problems. This didn’t help. However, at least this has helped in scanning a lot more N8 footage with the scanner as it let the gate-hatch  be raised in an almost entirely vertically position, meaning it didn’t stay in the way of the camera module built into the bottom of the keypad. Then, by holding down the film in the right part of the gate with one finger and letting the oversized film occassionally leave the film track, I could scan significantly more than with the gate-hatch fully closed down:

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Nevertheless, the scanning has stopped every now and then in this case too.

The occassional softness caused by the film leaving the track in this case isn’t really an issue. In the scanned footage below, you can see this in effect at around 0:02, 00:05, 00:08 etc. (Note that I used fully zoomed out (w=0) to overscan the film because the particular camera, the Kodak Brownie 8mm Movie Camera II, also shot between the sprocket holes.)

YouTube link

Then, after contemplating getting a laser cutter to cut the film itself, I decided to remove the film track for possible adjustment. To do this, you need to remove the four screws I’ve annotated in this shot with four arrows:

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Fortunately, unscrewing these screws doesn’t necessiate the removal of the entire mechanical assembly first – just removing the plastic facade will be sufficient.

The film track is, unfortunately, a one-piece (meaning no width microadjustment is possible), plastic thing (with the opened gate-hatch):

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And this is from the side, this time, with a caliper showing the exact width (8.05mm) of the film track:

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Another shot of the track, now, from the side, annotating the, in this shot, left side of the track:

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For my D8 films, the ideal width would be around 8.25mm, my films’ (I’ve measured this too) width fluctuating between 7.8 and 8.2mm. (The depth of the track is 1.5mm and the length 6.5mm.) I’ve already mailed the Winait folks to ask whether they offer a slightly widened version of the film track to Double users. I’ll let you know when they answer.

Should Winait not offer film tracks like this, I’ll also investigate making the track widened (done by a professional with professional CNC equipment, of course). Simply spindling some 0.2mm away from the lower (in the latest shot, left) side of the track.

For the time being: if you plan to scan Double films, you may have exactly the same problem. This is invisible in many old consumer projectors. For example, I have two copies of the Soviet “Rus” projector and they both play the same Double-8 films just fine. The scanner only allowing for strictly 8mm (at most) movies, however, currently makes it impossible to properly scan a lot of Double footage.

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Jean-Pierre Labus
Junior
Posts: 12
From: Puy de Dôme, France
Registered: Sep 2017


 - posted December 17, 2017 06:29 AM      Profile for Jean-Pierre Labus   Email Jean-Pierre Labus   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Is-it a new new version of Wolverine ?

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Have you any idea ?

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 09, 2018 01:22 AM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm happy to report that widening the film track did help with the Double issue I've explained about.

Note that most? all? CNC machines will NOT be able to do the trick. I've discussed this with several CNC operators and noone could widen the track. The problem was the entire plastic's being too fragile (too narrow), which would have made it prone to be simply popping out of the CNC bench during the processing, possibly also damaging the CNC itself.

Fortunately, just putting the track in a plain traditional vice and using a plain rasp did the trick. Using these tools, a friend of mine has managed to widen the track to around 8.23mm. The results are excellent: while there is no noticeable additional wobbling of films (significantly) narrower than 8.23mm (I've tested this with several Super8 and Double-8 films), almost all my problems with the Double-8 films getting stuck have been eliminated.

BTW, the Chinese folks still haven't answered my mail. That is, I don't know whether they plan to offer DIY enwidened tracks.

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 14, 2018 12:45 PM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Some of my exposure compensation experience you may be interested in:

Initially, I started experimenting with overriding the exposure because of the following: The general exposure is calculated using a full frame average. (As with all cheap film scanners - for example, the 14/22 Mpixel 36*24 ones.) This means it's considerably decreased when you digitize Standard 8 (not Super 8) with the sprocket holes taking up a significant area of the scanning frame. (For example, in order to digitize the possibly exposed area between the sprockets, as can also be seen in the examples below.) Then, based on how much of the sprockets are included in the frame, you'll really want to bump the exposure by, in general, 0.5EV.

To find out how the (limited) dynamic range of the scanner handles under- and overexposure, I've grabbed the same frame from a scan run of (default) 0EV (non-default) and +0.5EV. (I had to do two runs as the first run resulted in the infamous wobbling at the top. In my experimens, most second runs are already stable. If they still aren't, a third run is necessary. In most cases, two runs were sufficient for most of my films; I needed to make a third run only once.)

Turns out the scanner is certainly better at preserving highlights (or originally generally over-exposed frames) than rendering the deeper shadows. This can clearly be seen in the following four framegrabs:

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(originally under-exposed frame. As you can see, the +0.5EV shot has a LOT of additional detail simply not present in the 0EV one.)

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(originally over-exposed frame. As you can see, the +0.5EV shot doesn't really have burnt-out detail compared to the 0EV one.)

(All this with ORWO UT-15 footage. Interestingly, this - back in the 80's - significantly cheaper material has turned out to keep its colors sigificnatly(!) better than the other and about two times more expensive material, AgfaChrome, I used for Super-8 shooting back in time. The latter has lost its green components almost entirely in 33+ years. I've kept the films in exactly the same place. ORWO wasn't that bad a material, after all...)

All in all, in general, to make good use of the DR of the scanner, you may want to prefer a slightly positive exposure compensation, particularly if you have some originally under-exposed shots in the roll and don't want to digitize those separately. (The latter is certainly my case - I don't have the time to scan every - short - shot separately. I prefer generic, global settings.)

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Peter Malling
Junior
Posts: 4
From: Farum, Denmark
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 15, 2018 04:30 PM      Profile for Peter Malling   Email Peter Malling   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What is the status now everybody who bought the Somikon scanner? Would you recommend to buy it for super 8 scanning?

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Peter

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 15, 2018 06:16 PM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
"What is the status now everybody who bought the Somikon scanner? Would you recommend to buy it for super 8 scanning?"

IMHO, it's great for the price. I'm very happy with it. Have scanned some 100 standard 8 and 10 Super 8 rolls so far.

And if you encounter the "wobbling" problem (I do in 20-30% of the cases), just re-scan the given roll. It'll help.

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Peter Malling
Junior
Posts: 4
From: Farum, Denmark
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 16, 2018 05:55 AM      Profile for Peter Malling   Email Peter Malling   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks Werner! Maybe I'll go for it then.

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Peter

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted January 19, 2018 04:11 PM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sorry for my neglect of this topic people! Been very busy with erverything besides my 8mmToDigital project. For instance building my new Ubiquiti UniFi home-network and VideoHi8 converting projects.

My 3rd Somikon is still boxed, so I hope I'll find sone time soon to carry out some new testing!

Good luck to all (new) Somikon users.

Cheers

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 20, 2018 05:35 PM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Folks, I've posted a quick tutorial on changing the framerate of the video on page 12 of the Wolverine topic:

http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=011395;p=12

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted January 28, 2018 05:53 AM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This may help with the wobbling problem: I've exhibited it quite frequently lately, but mostly with Super8 films. (The vast majority of my Std8 scans have been OK. I also found out that respool the entire film reel at least once before the scan reduced the around 20-30% wobbling percentage to almost zero. Again, this is Std8 only; with Super8, this doesn't really help.)

I've played with putting clothes pegs (clothes-pins) to force down the film to the gate. At first, I've tested this setup:

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(Of course, you'll need to remove the plastic facade first to gain full access to the bottom plate of the gate. It's easy.)

With this mod, the results became pretty OK: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ocj8MprCq4

NOTE:

1. the first 10-20 seconds have been taken without the clips applied. This is why they are super-wobbly there.

2. this is the East-German DEFA Super8 mm version of Rumpelstiltskin. The full documentation of what's happening in this film version (in German) is at https://www.flickr.com/photos/33448355@N07/39034875115/in/album-72157692569177485/ (see the right page; the left one is just a generic overview of the then-available DEFA films) and https://www.flickr.com/photos/33448355@N07/39034873185/in/album-72157692569177485/

Then, for the second half of the scan, I've removed the right clip, only keeping the left one. This has further helped, which could also be heard right away. (The clicks became much louder and more defined - almost as loud as with Std8 films.) The footage is here (the first seconds wobble as I still played with the clips then.): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYI-BXx3MDw

This trick may also help you if you encounter the same wobbling.

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Berend De Meyer
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 140
From: Leek, The Netherlands
Registered: Apr 2017


 - posted January 28, 2018 06:37 AM      Profile for Berend De Meyer   Email Berend De Meyer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Werner!

Thank you so much for your veey detailed workaround!

Cheers, Berend

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Cheers | “I am an advocate of the "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" modus operandi!”

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted February 03, 2018 09:40 AM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
And still modtime...

1, I've found out that, over time, the upper spring-loaded gate becomes so weak that the take-up wheel has a really destructive effect on the scanning, resulting in a lot of wobbling. My solution is simple: I just block the take-up wheel with a pen and let the film fall on the floor. From time to time, I remove the pen so that I can spool the film on the wheel:

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The image also shows a clip on the left side of the gate and also a slight push on the film backwards where it enters the gate to further minimize horizontal "dancing".

2. WRT the Standard-8 (double-8) problem I explained above: turns out (see the review starting with "Beware that you may need to "modify" the track" at https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1371442-REG/wolverine_data_f2dmmpro_moviemaker_pro_8mm_and_super_8.html ) others have had exactly the same problem, and the manufacturer even told them to use a knife to widen the track. Or, to send the entire(!) machine and a "sticky" film back to them so that they widen the track (for a fee).

(Now I wonder why the manufacturer didn't bother answering my mail, which I sent them some 6 weeks ago, asking for (not for free!) an already-modded gate...)

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Mike Spice
Master Film Handler

Posts: 421
From: none of your business
Registered: Jun 2017


 - posted February 03, 2018 04:18 PM      Profile for Mike Spice     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
are you not concerned that blocking the take up reel in this manner will put a great strain on the take up motor?

Would it not be possible to mount the take up reel on an independent assembly of some kind instead of on the scanner, if you choose to take up film this way?

just a thought.....

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted February 04, 2018 02:01 AM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yup - I'm thinking of soldering in an on/off switch to easily start/stop the take-up reel. Otherwise, when I can't block the movement any more (the reel has a lot of film so I can't insert a pen in there any more), I just take it off and only put back when I'm around and can spool the film.

BTW, so far, elminating the take up wheel's effect has worked great. About half of my S8 reels exhibit absolutely no wobbling right at the first scan; the other half in the second. Just an example of a scan done this way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyzXn1N6o_k

(East-Romania, 1981?; S8 Kodachrome; 12:30 minutes. Directly the scanner's output - no stabilization, no nothing, with as much overscan as possible (w=0).)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzicVCuHR7Y

(Czehoslovakia + Germany + France, 1975; 16:51; S8 Kodachrome. See the video description for some of the sights.)

[ February 04, 2018, 07:10 AM: Message edited by: Werner Ruotsalainen ]

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Werner Ruotsalainen
Film Handler

Posts: 97
From: Helsinki, Finland
Registered: Dec 2017


 - posted March 24, 2018 12:22 PM      Profile for Werner Ruotsalainen   Email Werner Ruotsalainen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Folks, I don't know whether this is only a Somikon-branded bug or also affects the Wolverine / Reflecta-branded ones as well: the "Sharpness" setting is fully disregarded at least in the latest (Oct/17, 2017; the one with the 20 fps) firmware. Please see my today's post in the Wolverine thread:

http://8mmforum.film-tech.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=011395;p=13

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Georg Muller
Junior
Posts: 8
From: De Panne, Belgium
Registered: Sep 2017


 - posted April 01, 2018 08:30 AM      Profile for Georg Muller     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Dear All,
I have 22 reels of 5" sound super8 movie to digitize. I made a test with a digitizing lab and got very bad results. I consider buying a Somikon-Wolverine-Reflecta-Winait device.
Could someone give me an answer on the following questions:
1) could the magnetic strips of the sound super8 film be damaged during the process of digitizing or is it safe?
2) My Eumig sound projector has a headphone outlet but when I listen I just get sound in the left ear, the right track is used for additional sounds like music but I never made use of it. My idea is to copy the first sound track on my computer. Can it be done just by connecting the headphone outlet of my projector to the mike inlet of my computer through a cable or do I need a special intermediate device? What do I have to do to get my mono track on the two loudspeakers of my computer.
3) I then have to synchronize sound track and movie. It won't be easy. Does a software exist?
Best regards.
Georg

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