Wolverine-Hawkeye Telecine

[David Brown]

Hey Bruce, I'm happy to see you getting after HDR!

I decided I was spending too much time on it when I was able to get ok results with WDR (in IC capture). I DO plan to revisit later.

I tried Hawkeye with Enfuse, Enfuse plugin for Lightroom, Photomatix plugin for LR, Lightroom HDR, and Photoshop HDR.

Some HDR software will not work with only 2 exposures, and/or using two separate folders.

Enfuse works as well as the others I mentioned above.I found there is enough range in film to do multiple exposures. I can't show samples having deleted all my tests. They filled my drive. These tiffs were 64bit! I only have 2 choices with the DFM-37UX226, 32b & 64b. Photomatix outputs 32b files, 64b may be overkill? I think both of these are using 8bits for transparency, that is wasted for us.

The scene I most tested had the subject in open shade with a bright blue sky and clouds. I exposed both frames 4 stops apart(1/4s-1/30s). That was enough, but the subject needed more emphasis, without clipping the highlights. Enfuse created a flat exposure.

Enfuse, and all these, mix the exposures, and leave the final tweek to the user. Maybe with 3 exposures, one 'normal', it could have produced a better auto mix?

Probably there is a way to weight midtones, and keep the rest balanced using Fred's scripts. If using Vdub or another editor these values can be adjusted. Be sure they are able to use the full files and are configured to work in 16b or 32b colors.


Stan, I don't think more than 3 captures would be useful. Does the new HDR 3 file capture only work with UX178?

I also wonder if it is useful to capture at 64b when there are multiple files, but the HDR output file should be 32b if it is to be adjusted.

[Bruce Davis]

Hi Stan, thanks again for your work, have tested the One-Dir version and find the placement of the 2 files into one folder works, but the exposure does not change, it stays on the level at which it is originally set.

[Stan Jelavic]

Thanks for the input David. The 3 exp app is for the UX178 only. I can modify the regular HDR app and add 3rd exposure. The scan time would have to be extended.
I added the 64 bit since it was available but believe it is an overkill for HDR.

I will look into the code Bruce.
Checked the code. Should work. Can you try two different dirs. The numbers will be staggered but the exposures should be correct.
Did the set the IncLow properly?

[Bruce Davis]

Hi David, did not see your post until now, you are right HDR is very time consuming and if results are similar with IC Capture and WDR then that is definitely the way to go.

Some of my S8 film has very large differences between light and dark, digital cameras just can not cope, HDR makes a big difference.

Everyone's experience is different but I found that programs like Photoshop, lightroom, Photomatix just do not give a good result without perhaps a lot of fiddling (more wasted time). The Enfuse plugin is limited in resolution unless one contributes, EnfuseGUI is not limited and is free, works the same as the command line Enfuse except it has a GUI.

My three favourite programs, Stan's Enfuse script, EnfuseGUI and Aurora HDR 2019, the last two require files to be in one folder.

I use 24bit or 32bit tiff files, but as you say its probably wasted to go to 64bit, Stan might know better, but I think as soon as VirtualDub2/AviSynth+3.7 and VideoFred script is used to process the files, the resulting video is only 8 bit anyway.

HDR does tend to leave some results a little flat (can be corrected in post, more time), I have only gone to 3 stops +-, found that to be sufficient, if one misses a little of the sky detail its not noticeable unless compared side by side. Three exposures would be worth comparing.

One other thing I have noticed with HDR, the images are a little softer, not as sharp as a single capture, its not huge but noticeable when zoomed in.

Regards - Bruce

Images below probably do not mean that much (UX178=HDR, 72BUC=IC Capture), as its perhaps an unfair comparison, but it compares the 72BUC camera result with the Sony UX178.

[David Brown]

I can easily see the difference in the two frames from post #1429 Bruce. HDR is worth having and I want it as an option. I have only needed it on two films so far. I might recreate the sample I referred to, the 4 stop HDR. Most films shot outdoors in full sun need something to lift the shadows, it's when the range of both extremes is severe that I would use it.

I have less options available for WDR with the 37UX226 than the 72BUC02, still it works well. I always have it on for every capture. The soft images you spoke of might come from the HDR software and/or settings. I've seen recommendations to use Photoshop's HDR (sharper) instead of Lightroom. You'd think they use the same routines. One might be behind the other for now.

I also considered doing multiple passes with Hawkeye. Hugin is part of the Enfuse 'family', it does frame alignment so I could do several captures at any exposure using Hawkeye. I'd recommend testing multiple captures of a single frame before trying an entire scene!! I have not tried this yet.

http://hugin.sourceforge.net/

Anyway, I'm still resolving the scratch and dirt removal, which is getting avisynth to run well. I've been pulled away from the 'editing room' for a little while now.

Stan, you deserve a golden projector or something for your service to this community!!! I also need to get back to the DSLR project.

[Stan Jelavic]

Ha ha not sure David if I deserve that but still thank you for the good words. Let me know if you want to try the 3 exposures.
I also have to get back to the homemade telecine with a custom transport.
Have another project trying to transcribe an old Austrian movie into English and having a hard time.
Bruce, your HDR captures look very impressive. Very good job. Check my post above regarding the HDR mod.

[Bruce Davis]

Hi Stan and David, Stan just realised you added to the post above, have edited to remove my previous comment.
David thanks for the link, will have a look at this more closely, from just a quick look it seems its a panorama stitching program but does more.
Thanks - Bruce

EDIT 2nd time
I see why there is an un-noticeable difference in exposures, in IncLow and DecLo from the original Hawkeye HDR program that I have, the setting is increased or decreased by 1 (one stop). The triple exposure and one folder versions increment by .1 (one tenth of a stop). I did not notice that there was a decimal point, so to set 3 stops = 30 clicks, that is a bit annoying, is there some other way to enter the number of stops?

[Stan Jelavic]

Hi Bruce,
Ok That makes sense now. Is one dir build working OK? How about the 3 exposure build?
I will add a direct number entry method in oppose to inc and dec.
Also continue feature.

[Bruce Davis]

Hi Stan, yes the 3 exposure and single folder are working, the reason the exposure was not working is because I was setting 3 stops as per normal with the original HDR program, not realising that the setting was actually only 0.3 stop, which made virtually no difference in exposure (not enough for me to be able to see any difference).
Regards - Bruce

P.S. The original HDR program indexes by 1 stop, the other two progs you provided, the inc dec indexes by only 0.1 stop.

[Stan Jelavic]

Yes I know. The reason was the UX178 which accepts decimal exposure values. Sorry about that should have mentioned that to you. I am working on a direct exposure entry. It is pretty simple.

[Bruce Davis]

Stan, sorry to repeat myself, but thought you might have missed one of my previous posts.

[Stan Jelavic]

Added the direct exposure increment entry Bruce. The number can be entered directly or up and down arrows can be used. The actual value will be the value shown divided by 10. Use Disp Exp to verify the exposure increment real value.
Similarly, added another number entry box for the initial image start number. Again, you can enter it directly or use the arrows. The display button is added and it is a bit redundant but it is ok to have it in case the image numbers go out of sync.
https://github.com/vintagefilmography/HDR-UX178-ONE-DIR
https://github.com/vintagefilmography/HDR-UX178-3-EXP

[David Brown]

Bruce, don't blame Stan for the .1 inc/dec. It was my request for HDR. I was trying to match the shutter speeds displayed in IC Capture. I would find the exposures that worked before setting up Hawkeye's HDR.

http://hugin.sourceforge.net/docs/ma...of_photos.html

This is where I found a references to Hugin, but like I said, I have not tried using Hugin yet.

Cheers!

[Bruce Davis]

Hi Stan and David, Thank you Stan for the updated HDR versions, have tested both with just short clips for now and they are working for exposure and single folder. I know it depends on start position of the claw, but if the claw is at the start of the UP position, I found that with the 2 exposure 1 folder I need to delete the first image and with the 3 exposure 1 folder I need to delete the first two images so that the rest of the images match.

David I would never "blame" Stan (I know your joking), I was just not seeing the decimal point in the new versions to allow for finer adjustment, glad you asked Stan to make the change, this adds flexibility. Thanks for the 2nd link, will read this information.
Regards - Bruce

[Stan Jelavic]

Glad the changes worked out for you Bruce. David joking? Never...