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Author
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Topic: ebay,here we go again
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted January 22, 2013 01:17 PM
Recently i sold reel 2 of Master and commander, in very good condition with no faults on ebay, sent it to another forum member,(no names to be mentioned at this time) and after winning it for a good sum, i was pleased, they recieve it and complain, apparantly the balance track is coming off?????it cetainlt wasnt when it left me, i would never have accepted it from derann if it was.
When i offered a full refund, (as he wanted me to give back £15)) excluding my costs and postage i get the inevitable case against me as external damage not as described etc, unless i refund him £15, in other words, he clearly thinks he bid more thsn he should, probably realised reel two isnt full of action and wants it for £15 less than he bid.
Now then, its an auction, i know the film is excellent, i bought it new from Derann and it plays perfect on my Twin track Elmo 1200HD no sound defects, if there was i would have sent it back. I sold it as a second hand film to project not a re-recording project, Funny isnt it, he says its faulty, (i know it isnt) yet he wants to keep it if i pay him £15.00. Sounds like a bit of bribing, in other words, give me £15 and i wont leave negative feedback.
Sad, whats your thoughts on this, & this is a side of e bay that really gets to me, you bid on an auction and thats that, if you dont want to pay more than a certain amount then stop bidding,yes/no ?????
[ January 22, 2013, 03:59 PM: Message edited by: Tom Photiou ]
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted January 22, 2013 01:55 PM
Thanks for your replies, here is what the buyer said to me copied and pasted word for word,
Hello - I make you the offer to pay me 15 GBP back by Paypal. I will now open the case and you only make your ok. That's more than fair and you have no problem with it.
Otherwise you have to pay me back the total price including postage, ebay will pay you the fee back and I have to sent it on my costs to you.
If i end up with negative feedback from this threat i will be back on to name the seller after to warn everyone, after all i repeat, its an auction, i always try to be fair and just for the record, (and this p***d me off as it goes against my principle) i have offered a £10 refund as a goodwill jesture and i did state i am doing this only because the seller was a fellow forum menber, i state this film is in excellent condition, my only reason for selling it is simple, i was hoping to get more of this film reel by reel as i do have part 5 which is all action, reel two to reel 5 doesnt follow too weell and with Derann gone there wont be any more chances of any more odd parts,
BTW, he took a week to pay for it, i had to chase that up and i sent it in bubble wrap and a jiffy bag via airmail,when he got it out ccame the complaints of not being able to re-record and he reckons in a year it will become a silent copy, and claimed it wasnt worth half what he paid, WHY BID????? how much clearer can i make it, PART 2 ONLY.
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted January 22, 2013 03:33 PM
Thanks Hugh, i certainly will name him if it gets sour, i stand to at least lose a tenner, i'll just have to ensure i make it clear on my listings that there will be no refunds, i know for a fact that this item was like new and we'v had it for a number a years and it plays brilliantly on both tracks, its a second hand movie at the end of the day, i have had two experiences on e bay like this before, one was a CD player, sold it as new and the twat that bought it tried to say it was full of faults, then there was the guy i bought a film from who had a pic of 2 x 800ft spools and i recieved a totaly different item on one spool, this burke even said see you in court to which my reply was "fine" one e mail later i was able to return the item and get a refund, The later has put me off ever buying again, and this latest one from "germany" is making me wonder if its worth it but i will name if neccessary, i wouldnt be suprised if i get it back scratched up or something.
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Hugh Thompson Scott
Film God
Posts: 3063
From: Gt. Clifton,Cumbria,England
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted January 22, 2013 04:18 PM
Well I'll try to make you feel a bit better Tom,just before Christmas,on
German ebay,I spied a classic euro horror from one of my favourite
directors, Mario Bava.The film was in 2x400', and each 400' was
sold by a different seller.There was no problem shipping to the UK
why should there be, the film arrived, part two with a picture fault, not
much, but an intermittent movement.I said nothing and waited
and waited for the next instalment, it arrived well after Christmas,having been shipped just in time for the rush,four
weeks after ordering.On thinking it was part one ( the box said
part one) I discovered it was another part two.I don't know
what lesson can be learned here, as both these films weren't
cheap plus shipping.The seller was a lady whose English was
not good, but then I can't speak German, so I let it go, I think
that someone had innocently placed the spool in the wrong box, mistakes do happen,but costly to me.Such is life.
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Mark L Barton
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 621
From: Bristol, South Glos, England
Registered: Mar 2009
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posted January 24, 2013 08:57 AM
Tom, contact Ebay imediately with details of that email the seller sent you. what the seller is doing is extortion with the threat of a negative feedback etc. This is illegal and Ebay will not want to be apart of this and should consider the case very carefully. I had a guy drive to buy a car from me. he started to quibble on the price, so I saud forget it then. He got home and left me a negative, what! Ebay said ask the seller to retract the neg, I emailed him, he said give me £50 for my petrol and I will. I passed that email onto Ebay who immediately retracted the negative from my account.
When ebay allowed sellers to leave poor buyers a negative the system, within reason, worked. Now selling on ebay is a gamble, if you p@ss the buyer off they can cause serious amounts of trouble with ebay taking money from your paypal account and the buyer has the item. This stinks! Ebay is a good idea gone seriously bad, makes you wonder ..they made £800 million in the UK and paid just £1 million business tax..huh!
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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God
Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted January 24, 2013 09:03 AM
quote:
he started to quibble on the price, so I saud forget it then. He got home and left me a negative, what!
Mark, I am a bit loose with your story above, did you sell the car to him or not? How could he leave neg feedback if you said "forget it"? ![[Confused]](confused.gif)
Sorry for my English, but from the copy email above, Tom's buyer was negotiating to get refund on the item price + GBP 15 for the cost of shipping from UK to Germany, or Ebay would do that refund eventually.
Tom, the only way you can do is to ask the buyer to return the film in trackable shipment. This is accordance per Ebay rules. And some buyers do not want to this because it will cost more for them.
Buyer still can leave negative feedback, but then you don't need to refund the buyer.
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Winbert
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Christian Bjorgen
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 996
From: Kvinnherad, Norway
Registered: Oct 2009
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posted January 24, 2013 11:53 AM
I would, first of all, demand photographic evidence or some other proof of the fault. But even if the stripe is falling off, it's word against word. Other than that, you sell items on eBay "as is", and the buyers are aware of this! Unless the item is marked as brand new, it's an "as is" item.
I bought a film once, and the colour turned out to be horrible. But it said in the description "I have no idea how to evaluate the film, and it's sold as is", so I can't blame the seller.
That's the risk you take with buying on eBay, and the buyer in your case, Tom, needs to accept that. That's the way it's always been!
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Well who’s on first? Yeah. Go ahead and tell me. Who. The guy on first. Who. The guy playin’ first base. Who. The guy on first. Who is on first! What are you askin’ me for? I’m askin’ you!
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Dino Everette
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1535
From: Long Beach, CA USA
Registered: Dec 2008
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posted January 24, 2013 12:23 PM
Tom
I feel for you as ebay sometimes makes things very complicated by only allowing one sided feedback, but as someone who is often on the buyers side of bad deals, I can tell you the guy had to fill out the "case" to protect himself (I am not taking sides here as it sounds like this might be a bogus case) but an example where I bought something on french ebay, and I was waiting, waiting , waiting for it, and the seller kept saying it was coming, but I never rec'd it...Finally after 60 days I saw that the seller was now selling the exact same item again...I approached him and he said "This is a second copy of the film" (an 80 year old 9.5 used film by the way)and "You should have filed a claim if you did not receive the item, as now it has been too long and I can't do anything about it."
My point is that being a buyer you don't always know which sellers are giving you the runaround and which are honest, so ebay had made it such that filing the claim is the only way to be safe...
I am sorry you have to go through this though, but I agree I would ask for pics of the damage..
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"You're too Far Out Miss Lawrence"
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted January 24, 2013 01:13 PM
An update on my own situation with ebay ...
The buyer bought an ELMO 1200ft metal reel from me, and they put in a claim. I think what ebay will end up doing is a partial refund to the buyer, but even that seems a little wrong.
1. The item was shipped properly and it was a like new, unscratched ELMO 1200 metal reel.
2. Our own sales say "returns not excepted" as we auction off items exactly as described. No screwing the customer.
3. Beyond the buyers own word, I have no idea as to whether the reel did get to him all bent (un-use-able was what the buyer said) or not and asked on my reply to the claim that the buyer could send some pictures of the reel as proof. That way, if they are trying to keep a perfectly good reel and get they're money back, they would literally have to damage the reel to send the pictures and then they would get they're money back, but would not get the double satisfaction of money back and a lovely reel.
I know like a I sound like a pessimist here, but there's good cause ...
I sold another 1200ft ELMO reel to a fellow forum member years ago. They stated that the reel arrived destroyed and so I promptly took him at his word and returned his money.
Another fellow forum member, a friend, happened to be visiting him and the person who bought the reel boasted to my friend that they had just gotten a brand new ELMO 1200ft, complete with one small scratch on the metal, (I asked my friend about that as it was something that would obviously tell me if they had actually recieved the reel intact and use-able)
That really burned me and needless to say, I never sold anything to that person ever again ...
So, that's why I'm a little more than slightly pessemistic. It is possible that the reel arrived damaged, and I feel bad about that, but it doesn't seem proper for the seller, who mails off items promptly and responsibly, to have to cought up they're honorably won profits due to the "Possible" bad shipping actions of the post.
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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted January 24, 2013 03:05 PM
An update!!!
Since coming on here and also contacting ebay with a copy of the e mail i recieved the buyer has finally,(and so far politley) accepted my goodwill gesture of a £10 refund, although i am far from happy having to give anything back on an auction it appears to be OK, however i must say,
As far as the stripe coming off is concerned, we bought this odd copy and it has been with us almost since the day Master and Commander was released along with the action packed part 5, i cant say i wind films to look at the stripe as if there is a fault with it coming off or being too narrow it will have a faulty soundtrack, dropouts etc, this item has played perfectly and i last viewed it a week before listing to ensure it was fine in both image and sound and as always i treated it before listing with film guard, the buyer said in a year i could only sell it as a silent copy, which is utter nonsence. Any future listings i make i will almost certainly making my policy very clear. Apart from that what i havnt mentioned is that i did offer a full price refund excluding postage and my listing fee but the goodwill £10 refund has been accepted, in other words he's got it cheaper.
I am much wiser now and will never make this sort of offer again, interestingly, ebay for once agreed with me and talked to e bay Germany as this is where the case was opened so i couldnt respond to it as i didnt understand any it, E bay UK talked to them and passed on the e mail i recieved which they said was unacceptable and did say that as my listing states no refunds i did not have to make any offers or refunds, but i am a nice chap ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif) ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Many thanks to all replies and i will let you know the final outcome.
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Tom Photiou
Film God
Posts: 4837
From: Plymouth U.K
Registered: Dec 2003
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posted January 25, 2013 01:00 PM
Final Update,
I have as a goodwill gesture refunded a tenner to the buyer with his agreement after i contacted e bay and came on here, case now closed,
Have to say in future i will be making my policy very clear to all, if i have a duff or faulty print i would aleways say so, after all, what on earth is the point in trying to pass off a problem item, its surly going to bite you back, im quite gutted but its resolved. I shall see what happens now. Another lesson learned i guess.
[ January 27, 2013, 12:43 PM: Message edited by: Tom Photiou ]
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