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Author
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Topic: What is the most failure of super 8mm release (post 1985)
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Winbert Hutahaean
Film God
Posts: 5468
From: Nouméa, New Caledonia
Registered: Jun 2003
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posted February 22, 2013 09:42 AM
Ok guys,
We usually discuss "film you wish to be released"...but now I am talking the opposite.
In the super 8mm heyday people did not really care what was released. So film like "The Rose" can be released by Ken Films.
But after 1985 only few companies left, namely Derann, CHC, RedFox, Kempinski, Perry, Independent8 and some others.
They must released some titles but the options were limited. Perhaps one or two titles fell into the category of "failure to get buyers" or "I don't want to see/buy it even it is on film".
Can you share what do you think the titles fall into this category.
I will divide into two type of editing/version:
a. Digest/Short/scene select (i.e between 200' - 800')
and
b. Mini Feature/Full Feature (anything above 1200')
My self will say:
a. End of the Days (Derann, 600')
b. Chicken Run (CHC, F/L)
ps: Do not get confused with the quality of the print. We consider all prints were printed good. I just want to focus on the title/story. And they must have been released post 1985.
So what is yours?
[ February 23, 2013, 04:07 PM: Message edited by: Winbert Hutahaean ]
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Winbert
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James N. Savage 3
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1375
From: Washington, DC
Registered: Jul 2003
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posted February 22, 2013 01:55 PM
Unfortunately, the title song, "The Rose", didn't make it onto KEN's 400 foot digest. I think this was the biggest disappointment about the digest. It was actually well-edited, other than this one issue.
The thing about The Rose is that, it was very popular "in the moment", back in '79 when it came out, but its not a movie that lives on decades later, like Star Wars or other films that appeal to home cinema enthusiests.
Back to Winbert's question-
I often wonder the same thing. One title that comes to mind is "Highlander". I remember Derann promoting this feature back in the late 80's/early 90's. It was advertised for a long time, yet I've never seen this movie on used film sales lists, so either its so good/popular that no one wants to let go of it, or, nobody bought a copy.
James.
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Adrian Winchester
Film God
Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004
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posted February 22, 2013 05:05 PM
Actually the early 1990s scene was a bit different to the line-up indicated above. Red Fox and Kempski were no longer trading and I think this was before CHC started, but CEC were still releasing a few films. I think one of their features 'FX - Murder By Illusion' sold badly so it might be a contender if it was out by 1990. As for a digest/short, that's really difficult as there were quite a few that most of us would have little to go on in terms of sales. You may well be right that 'End of Days' was a contender, but I also wouldn't be surprised if the extract from 'The Lord of the Rings' (was it the second film in the series?) didn't do too well - I recall being disappointed by the content when I saw it. It didn't help that such releases were basically extracts rather than edited versions, so incomprehensible to people who didn't know the features. I think the Matrix extracts must have done OK as otherwise they would have stopped after the first one. Some of the later Derann releases had disappointing print quality with high contrast images, and so one or two like 'Early Bloomer' may have also sold badly, although I can't recall if that was one of the worse ones.
I believe the Grape Ape featured in Techno releases from earlier times, so isn't applicable here.
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Adrian Winchester
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Osi Osgood
Film God
Posts: 10204
From: Mountian Home, ID.
Registered: Jul 2005
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posted February 22, 2013 05:51 PM
It must also be understood that, as a general rukle, any releases, (especially in the 90's and beyond) were not just printed en masse or "willy nilly").
As a general rule, the independent companies that still exist, (including us at GIOSI films, though were quite dormant now, but would love to release again!), only print by demand as, each time a super 8 print is made, there are two copies made, which means that either the person who wants it, buys both or, the distributor has to find someone to buy the other copy, and usually, at a loss.
This is especially true when it comes to features because of the enormous cost that is ensued with just putting it out on super 8.
By the way, I just want to say a big thanks to those who own the 35MM feature prints that the lab of today uses to actually make the new prints hat are being made today. Without this or that person making prints from thier library available, there wouldbe NO new feature releases, or shorts, or cartoons, trailers, ect.
Yes, "End of Days", good choice.
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"All these moments will be lost in time, just like ... tears, in the rain. "
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James N. Savage 3
Phenomenal Film Handler
Posts: 1375
From: Washington, DC
Registered: Jul 2003
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posted February 22, 2013 06:22 PM
I purchased "Storm of the Sentinels" (Matrix extract), mostly to support Derann at the time. But I think it, as well as "End of Days" were poor choices. "Sentinels" is a somewhat colorless scene, as it takes place underground. The processing labs actually did a good job on the print, as its not too dark, like we know super 8 prints can be from time to time (See my review in the review section). But really, this is not the best type of material for a super 8 scope release.
Winbert- This is a great thread you started! Its spawned several interesting additional topics already.
Back on-topic now-
I think another poor-sales candidate would be Derann's "Police Academy 2". It is a 2 x 600 foot digest, and one that is seldom seen or talked about. (Although, I'm considering buying it if it ever pops up- the movie's grown on me through the years ![[Smile]](smile.gif) ).
James.
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Adrian Winchester
Film God
Posts: 2941
From: Croydon, London, UK
Registered: Aug 2004
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posted February 22, 2013 07:44 PM
'Police Academy 2' was actually quite early in the Super 8 revival, around the mid-1980s. Even if sales were comparatively poor, the market was bigger at the time.
I thought of a couple of Derann features that Derek acknowledged had sold in very disappointing numbers - 'Rocky' and 'Halloween', but I think that perhaps they were released by 1990, but even if they weren't, I'm sure that sales at least reached 20, which couldn't be said for some releases. Incidentally, I believe that CHC only printed 10 copies of 'The Day the Earth Stood Still', but as I temporarily owned a print, I think I can imagine why, in view of certain flaws that didn't encourage sales.
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Adrian Winchester
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Christian Bjorgen
Jedi Master Film Handler
Posts: 996
From: Kvinnherad, Norway
Registered: Oct 2009
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posted February 23, 2013 05:00 AM
I know that "Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day", one of the last 600' made by Derann, had quite poor numbers. One of my sources tell me that only eight prints were made (four runs on 16mm split), one of which is in Adrian Simmonds personal collection, as only seven of them were sold. Maybe it's because Super 8 had long since come to a "halt", at least as a mass market medium, as this was already in the early 2000s if my sources are correct.
I think what many here are saying could be a very valid reason, with limited prints and high prices, collectors have to pick carefully. I would be furious if I paid hundreds of dollars for a feature I "liked", just to see that next months release was a feature I loved! So like many are stating, I think most colllectors sat on the hands, waiting for the right print to come along, and so many prints that were in fact interesting prints; such as "Blustery Day", went the way of the dodo because the cash was saved for a "better choice".
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Well who’s on first? Yeah. Go ahead and tell me. Who. The guy on first. Who. The guy playin’ first base. Who. The guy on first. Who is on first! What are you askin’ me for? I’m askin’ you!
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Hugh Thompson Scott
Film God
Posts: 3063
From: Gt. Clifton,Cumbria,England
Registered: Jan 2012
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posted February 23, 2013 07:06 AM
Actually Mark, Derann's biggest seller was "THE SCARS OF DRACULA"
way back in the '70's that was available in 8reel col & b/w plus
the 400' versions & A STD 8 full feature,which is why Derek re released it complete.Derek released over 1400 copies of this film
alone, before the unedited feature was put out.
One release that didn't do as well as expected was "Fantastic Voyage",which led to Derek saying that he never wanted to hear
the words Science Fiction again, "Soylent Green" might also be a contender.
[ February 23, 2013, 10:40 AM: Message edited by: Hugh Thompson Scott ]
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